[X] My Assistant

Crude IW @IWBTH, lower to Nintendo if you need to cure too often.
Switching out your robe would be a bad decision at the moment.
With only gloves you would face nearly full dark mitigation and higher resist.

Actually your gloves are pretty crappy (I don't think they would be worth even 50k), I would consider upgrading them as soon as possible.
Same is true for cap.
Robe, pants and shoes are elemental prefixed but at least the important roll is there.
Get a good cap and gloves and start forging and IWing.

Also start forging MDB on staff as soon as possible, it's the biggest damage upgrade you can get.
BoD are costly but the damage boost you will get it's worth it.
Imho without Crystarium III and Archaeologist ~6 GFs are not that good.
Also unless you have LGBD you can use all your stamina in arenas so don't bother doing GF without perks/training and LGBD.

Ya, been trying to find replacements for both of those, haven't found any good ones in auction nor WTS yet (of course I was looking for over a month for a LDWD and then 2 pop'ed up in auction back to back so they'll show up eventually I guess).

For forging, should I even bother forging the phase? Those crystal phazons are about 200mil ea and I don't think(?) you get them back from salvaging, so i guess just start forging the hell outta my staff and cotton? Also when I looked through various Forge calculators MDB was the smallest damage upgrade out of MDB, EDB, and prof bonus cost wise, Not by a ton, but those bindings costs take their toll.

And ya, I see GF not worth it without a lot of perks/traning, which is why I'm asking which perks/tranings I need and which difficulty I should run it on to be worth it so I can start working on it at least.

Btw thanks you to everyone who has given me advice so far.

I'd love for a few of those superiors to be tokens or artifacts.
If those extra 250 drops had bypassed the equipment branch, maybe a few would have worked out for me.
Maybe it would be every 37 rounds. I'd prefer that instead of a bunch of average/superiors.

The difference of between no QM and max QM is an extra token every 38 tokens. At QM 7 you're only missing one token every 110.4 tokens.

This post has been edited by sigo8: May 22 2017, 01:57

For forging, should I even bother forging the phase? Those crystal phazons are about 200mil ea and I don't think(?) you get them back from salvaging, so i guess just start forging the hell outta my staff and cotton? Also when I looked through various Forge calculators MDB was the smallest damage upgrade out of MDB, EDB, and prof bonus cost wise, Not by a ton, but those bindings costs take their toll.

No, you get phazons back as normal, only catalysts are lost.
Also you are already at 23 with dark EDB and Prof so the next upgrade cost will rise sharply (peaking at ~57k after 25), meanwhile MDB cost is only sligthly higher but the effectiveness is much higher (at similar forge level you will get 2X the effect compared to EDB and 4X compared to prof) so if you decided to forge prof on staff because of calculators either you used them wrong or they don't give meaningful result.

Ah, right, you should tweak your stat distribution:
STR is a bit high (should be 0 or next to 0)
AGI and INT are a bit low
WIS is a bit too high

Try to keep the main stats close to each other, DEX should be lower (your current value is ok), STR should be 0.

This post has been edited by Sapo84: May 22 2017, 02:16

The difference of between no QM and max QM is an extra token every 38 tokens. At QM 7 you're only missing one token every 110.4 tokens.

Would this be true with all training maxed beside Quartermaster, and all related Hath Perks maxed?

It's kind of confusing that if a person has scavenger training maxed and Tokenizer maxed...
Then the 250 extra that didn't get passed to the equipment branch in a given set of rounds....

That only 1 of those 250 would pass through the token or artifact branch regardless of other training.

And would it be more that 250 extra passes if Luck of the Draw is maxed?

And I can't find in the tree or the explanation below the logic tree where Luck of the Draw does anything besides improving the chances of a token drop or Elixor instead of Draughts, etc.

It appears Luck of the Draw has zero effect on equipment.

There is just so many variables in that tree, and with equipment on top, then yes...
those 250 extra equipment drops "would" be passed through if quartermaster is zero.
And considering scavenger determines how many total of "all" variables drop....

Yeah.. it get confusing on how we can determine that we get 250 extra equipment drops with Quartermaster maxed...
Yet... only 1 of those 250 drops would otherwise be a token.

No, you get phazons back as normal, only catalysts are lost.

Can the Wiki be edit to remove:
Rares
Cannot be gotten from salvaging.
Name Required to Reforge
Crystallized Phazon Phase armor
Shade Fragment Shade armor
Repurposed Actuator Power armor
Defense Matrix Modulator Force Shield
https://ehwiki.org/wiki/Salvage#Basic_Materials

because the implication is they are un-recoverable if you salvage gear. Even if it means that you can't obtain new ones via salvaging brand new dropped gear, it's misleading because the next subsection, binding, does not contain the "Cannot be gotten from salvaging." line.

This post has been edited by abc12345678901: May 22 2017, 02:30

is there a way to see actual result of training? like "character exp bonus = **%" or something like that.

Not really, unfortunately.

Ya i still need to train staff, what's the best way? I know people say crude IW, but what difficulty? Should I switch to weakest staff I have to train it?

If I change my robe to a phase one, it would need an EDB base of ~ 22.5 to compensate the damage loss of proficiency (with or without imperil) which is 184% EDB, don't think those exist (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif) Unless you're suggesting switching out pieces between phase and cotton, in which case which phase should be switched to cotton to compensate for the robe switching to phase?

Will forge my staff more, as well as my forbidden prof on my cloth pieces since I'm still a ways from cap on forbidden prof.

I'm intrested in doing GF, but last time I did it on hell I got to around round 500 and only got a very small return for the time and stamina invested (though I have about 20% more damage now). If I were to go for grindfest, which trainings, crystal perks/token perks, and difficulty should i need/play on as a minimum?

I trained my staff proficiency on IWBTH in crude axe, using full shade of the fleet and an ethereal staff. It doesn't matter the staff quality, as you want it to have as little damage as possible, so just equip it while naked and go into GF and die a few times until the durability reaches 1%.

As your cloth proficiency is high, you can try grinding wearing your normal mage equipment too.

-------------------------

The best mage setup I'm aware of is a good prof Cap/Gloves/Shoes, choosing two of them to fully forge and using phase for the three remaining slots.

Like Sapo84 said, you still need to change your Cap and Gloves, as they aren't the best out there, but as it seems you are playing mostly on Hell, you might even try to switch cap and gloves to phase and stick to 4+1 and see if it works.

-------------------------

I've switched completely from playing arenas to GFs only, and it's been quite good so far.

I have archeologist 8/10, Token II and LGBD, so I get a decent amount of artifacts and tokens daily, while also passively getting other stuff to sell, like rare consumables, amnesia shards, scrolls, infucions and such, which stockpile quite quickly playing more rounds daily.

If you get crystal perks and go all the way to the end of a grindfest, it's even better, considering another extra income from crystals.

I personaly use the oens I get myself, as the selling price isn't as good as it used to be.

And I can't find in the tree or the explanation below the logic tree where Luck of the Draw does anything besides improving the chances of a token drop or Elixor instead of Draughts, etc.

It appears Luck of the Draw has zero effect on equipment.

LotD affects if an equipment drops as rare tier or not, so you have more chances of a drops being force, power, shade and phase.

It used to also affect katana's and wakizashi's drop rates as well, but now they are normal tier equipment too.

(snip)

I have archeologist 8/10, Token II and LGBD, so I get a decent amount of artifacts and tokens daily, while also passively getting other stuff to sell, like rare consumables, amnesia shards, scrolls, infucions and such, which stockpile quite quickly playing more rounds daily.


I personaly use the oens I get myself, as the selling price isn't as good as it used to be.

On the topic of amnesia shards... Is it just me or are they super rare? I almost never get any; maybe 1 in every 10k-15k monsters. I play about 75% IWBTH and 25% PFUDOR

Yeah.. it get confusing on how we can determine that we get 250 extra equipment drops with Quartermaster maxed...
Yet... only 1 of those 250 drops would otherwise be a token.

Not really confusing at all, I don't think.

First off, Scavenger is irrelevant in this calculation. All it does is improve the chances of getting a drop, period. The question is what kind the drop will be, which Scavenger doesn't affect in the slightest.

So using a sufficiently large sample base of 10,000 successful drop rolls, a simple breakdown would be:

With 0 training across the board:

250 equipment
19.5 artifacts
19.46 tokens
3398.86 crystals
3398.86 restoratives (draught/potion/elixir)
2913.32 everything else (infusions, scrolls, shards, food, etc)

With maxed Quartermaster:

500 equipment
19 artifacts
18.96 tokens
3311.71 crystals
3311.71 restoratives
2838.62 everything else

So it's exactly as sigo8 said. By the time a player with no QM would have 39 tokens, a player with maxed QM would have 38 (as well as +500 more equipment). So the difference is minimal.

This post has been edited by friggo: May 22 2017, 02:55

With 0 training across the board:

250 equipment
19.5 artifacts
19.46 tokens
3398.86 crystals
3398.86 restoratives (draught/potion/elixir)
2913.32 everything else (infusions, scrolls, shards, food, etc)

With maxed Quartermaster:

500 equipment
19 artifacts
18.96 tokens
3311.71 crystals
3311.71 restoratives
2838.62 everything else

So it's exactly as sigo8 said. By the time a player with no QM would have 39 tokens, a player with maxed QM would have 38 (as well as +500 more equipment). So the difference is minimal.

So you see my confusion.

There are several variables involved.
If this was turned around and say... I don't know.... the chances of getting a token is quadrupled....
And every roll is unique. Why would it be beneficial to allow that slot to go to an "Average mace of rotten wood"?
Why not allow those 250 to flow down and possibly trigger an artifact or token?
Especially if you're maxed on those.

And then also... 250 more rolls going to equipment, how many will be anything other than bazaar fodder?
I would venture to say all of them would be exquisite and below, and usually superiors.
If playing on Hell, then Averages for the majority.

So that 250 would end up netting at max, 50k in bazaar fodder, unless that 1 in 10,000 hit for a legendary.
And the huge majority of Legendary drops are trash. So still... max 20k in HGC.

If a person can afford to max out all training and perks, then seriously.. it's a good consideration not to go for equipment.

Especially since we're all going to end up buying the equipment we want to use anyway.

Those tokens are much more valuable,.
Especially with >PL1000 monsters that are dropping High grades daily.
Those artifacts give us a 1 in 5 chance of a 100k ED.

In the accomplishment thread, someone just finished a 1,000 round PFfest.

Analyze it for a few. Over a hundred bazaar fodder at average 200credits each.
Where is the majority of his income?

So you see my confusion.

There are several variables involved.
If this was turned around and say... I don't know.... the chances of getting a token is quadrupled....

Okay, quadruple token drop chance (Tokenizer III) out of 10,000 drops:

With 0 training: 77.84
With maxed QM: 75.85

So basically you've got to ask yourself: Do I consider 2 extra tokens to be more valuable than 250 extra equipment? If the answer is yes, then by all means don't get Quartermaster. But for me personally, I'd rather have the equipment. That's all there is to it.

So you see my confusion.

There are several variables involved.
If this was turned around and say... I don't know.... the chances of getting a token is quadrupled....
And every roll is unique. Why would it be beneficial to allow that slot to go to an "Average mace of rotten wood"?
Why not allow those 250 to flow down and possibly trigger an artifact or token?
Especially if you're maxed on those.

And then also... 250 more rolls going to equipment, how many will be anything other than bazaar fodder?
I would venture to say all of them would be exquisite and below, and usually superiors.
If playing on Hell, then Averages for the majority.

So that 250 would end up netting at max, 50k in bazaar fodder, unless that 1 in 10,000 hit for a legendary.
And the huge majority of Legendary drops are trash. So still... max 20k in HGC.

But if you allow those 250 rolls to flow, on average you'd only get 1 precursor (at max'ed artifact traning =25k) and 1/2 of a token (times which ever perk level you have) and ~248.5 rolls of crap. I guess it depends on how much you value tokens at. One thing to consider though is that the average cost of equipment @200c ea is for lower difficulties, if you're ever playing on nintendo or higher, even junk gear is going to bazzar for far more (junk equisites cloth and staff/sheild is min of 500c in items if salvage'd) so that's where that training will likely shine.

So you see my confusion.

There are several variables involved.
If this was turned around and say... I don't know.... the chances of getting a token is quadrupled....
And every roll is unique. Why would it be beneficial to allow that slot to go to an "Average mace of rotten wood"?
Why not allow those 250 to flow down and possibly trigger an artifact or token?
Especially if you're maxed on those.

And then also... 250 more rolls going to equipment, how many will be anything other than bazaar fodder?
I would venture to say all of them would be exquisite and below, and usually superiors.
If playing on Hell, then Averages for the majority.

So that 250 would end up netting at max, 50k in bazaar fodder, unless that 1 in 10,000 hit for a legendary.
And the huge majority of Legendary drops are trash. So still... max 20k in HGC.

If a person can afford to max out all training and perks, then seriously.. it's a good consideration not to go for equipment.

Especially since we're all going to end up buying the equipment we want to use anyway.

Those tokens are much more valuable,.
Especially with >PL1000 monsters that are dropping High grades daily.
Those artifacts give us a 1 in 5 chance of a 100k ED.

In the accomplishment thread, someone just finished a 1,000 round PFfest.

Analyze it for a few. Over a hundred bazaar fodder at average 200credits each.
Where is the majority of his income?

Not sure if you've met this bottleneck or not, but at the highest level a lot of equipment don't even make it to the open market. Often times the most reliable way to get the high quality equipment you want is to grind it yourself. By the time you have multi millions, money doesn't really matter (see the charged phase elec items). That's why I believe grinding pfudor fest even if you flee at 500/700 with quartermaster is optimal.

The only case I'd recommend going 0 quarter master is if a char is only for gold-making on hell gf.

Okay, quadruple token drop chance (Tokenizer III) out of 10,000 drops:

With 0 training: 77.84
With maxed QM: 75.85

So basically you've got to ask yourself: Do I consider 2 extra tokens to be more valuable than 250 extra equipment? If the answer is yes, then by all means don't get Quartermaster. But for me personally, I'd rather have the equipment. That's all there is to it.

That's good. I agree if you are looking at the equipment for income.
However..
If the bazaar income has no significant value to the player, and all other training is maxed out,
then the equation changes from simply 2 from QM=0 to QM equals maxed.
Both tokens and artifacts will increase at the expense of very little flow of bazaar income.

But like you said, it all depends on which way a person is looking at the game.

But if you allow those 250 rolls to flow, on average you'd only get 1 precursor (at max'ed artifact traning =25k) and 1/2 of a token (times which ever perk level you have) and ~248.5 rolls of crap. I guess it depends on how much you value tokens at. One thing to consider though is that the average cost of equipment @200c ea is for lower difficulties, if you're ever playing on nintendo or higher, even junk gear is going to bazzar for far more (junk equisites cloth and staff/sheild is min of 500c in items if salvage'd) so that's where that training will likely shine.

True that... some exquisites will net 800cr and above.

I guess it's just as friggo said. It all depends on what we're wanting. Equipment, credits, or whatever.
My goal is 200 monsters at >PL1100.
So Tokens are incredibly important to me.
Therefore... (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I wish my quartermaster was zero.

Because so far... playing every single day for over a year. Quartermaster has not paid off.
The tokens "are" paying off. The artifacts "are" paying off. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

So, I've moved from arenas to GF. I am going with IWBTH for now; I can get to level 600-650 in around an hour and a half, or around 150 on PFUDOR in 30 minutes before I end up either dieing or fleeing.

What should I look at doing to up the clear speed/ max rounds? I'm using one 1H and the following:

I just spent about 5m credits on the upgrades to my rapier yersterday, selling off all of my accumulated hath (currently get around 65-70 hath/day)


(IMG:[i.imgur.com] http://i.imgur.com/cBKz2Nu.png)

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)

I spent 36.89m for drop training.

still remain 38.51m.

Do you think I should go on? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)

I spent 36.89m for drop training.

still remain 38.51m.

Do you think I should go on? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

You're rich? So yes.

You're poor? Then no.

Simple. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)

On the topic of amnesia shards... Is it just me or are they super rare? I almost never get any; maybe 1 in every 10k-15k monsters. I play about 75% IWBTH and 25% PFUDOR

Usually I get a lot more featherweights than anything else, passing some days without a single amnesia playing 2.2k rounds of GF, but the next day I get 2 and no featherweights.

All RNG, but they might be on the same level of getting bubble-gum and flower vase.

So, I've moved from arenas to GF. I am going with IWBTH for now; I can get to level 600-650 in around an hour and a half, or around 150 on PFUDOR in 30 minutes before I end up either dieing or fleeing.

What should I look at doing to up the clear speed/ max rounds? I'm using one 1H and the following:

I just spent about 5m credits on the upgrades to my rapier yersterday, selling off all of my accumulated hath (currently get around 65-70 hath/day)

-huuuge picture-

Forge your block more and change to a full slaughter set.

Then you can also do some forging on the high ADB pieces, mainly chest and leggings.

When you get deep in GF, you can start using Haste and Shadow Veil as well to reduce damage if you have to cure a lot.

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)

I spent 36.89m for drop training.

still remain 38.51m.

Do you think I should go on? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

I'd say to not invest in Scavenger and LotD anymore.

Fully maxed scavenger only gives you a boost of 2.5% drop rate, while monster PL can give you up to 15% bonus.

You can train archeo and quarter if you want, but I'd only invest in the last levels when I'm catgrill status with 1 gazilion active Adopt-a-Server slots, pretty much having nowhere else to sink credits on.

Forge your block more and change to a full slaughter set.

Slaughter is hard to find though XD

I use shadow vail, but i've been skipping on haste from previous advice

Should I look for a Legendary shield, or is what I have good enough, and just forge that on up to max?

Also, sorry if the picture shows up big... I tried to crop it/shrink it down >.<

This post has been edited by SidZBear: May 22 2017, 06:26

Slaughter is hard to find though XD

I use shadow vail, but i've been skipping on haste from previous advice

Should I look for a Legendary shield, or is what I have good enough, and just forge that on up to max?

Also, sorry if the picture shows up big... I tried to crop it/shrink it down >.<

skipping on haste isnt going to help you much until you get a well forged leg force shield with good block%.

Legendary shield first, then start accumulating slaughter gear while increasing the block on your new shield. the most important stat is block, you want to make sure you buy one around 90% with str/dex/end; other stuff isnt as important. don't rush the slaughter search, you may be able to find all the pieces available in shops but they are usually slightly to extremely overpriced. just try to acquire one piece a week in the auctions.