[X] My Assistant

Coalesced Mana is useless, but Staff Spell Damage is very nice.

"Staff Spell Damage" ability, red (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

OK. Thanks! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Coalesced Mana is useless, but Staff Spell Damage is very nice.

I think it's a level thing with being below 400.
I don't really have mana usage under control just yet.

But... of course Staff Spell Damage causing quicker kills.. will go further in mana control.

I guess I'll be playing "whackamonster with a stick" for a while longer! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I think it's a level thing with being below 400.
I don't really have mana usage under control just yet.

But... of course Staff Spell Damage causing quicker kills.. will go further in mana control.

I guess I'll be playing "whackamonster with a stick" for a while longer! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Even when you take that into consideration, it's pretty bad. The opportunity cost of a turn is just too high in comparison to the minuscule amount of credits saved in mana potions/elixirs.

Even when you take that into consideration, it's pretty bad. The opportunity cost of a turn is just too high in comparison to the minuscule amount of credits saved in mana potions/elixirs.

The mana draughts and potions I go through like candy and I never care.

But the mana elixir usage, I was under the impression I should try to conserve.

Is that an incorrect assumption on my part? Or should I just try to moderate elixirs?

tbh, I've never looked at the cost of elixirs, because I was always DW.
They just kinda added up.

You should never have to buy a single mana potion/elixir/draught. If you're willing to grind, just drop your difficulty to nightmare/hell and use focus to regain mana when necessary.

This post has been edited by tganimation6: Feb 13 2017, 04:47

You should never have to buy a single mana potion/elixir/draught. If you're willing to grind, just drop your difficulty to nightmare/hell and use focus to regain mana when necessary.

Sounds good.

I've got so many, I could probably go a year even if none were ever dropped.
It just somehow got stuck in my head to conserve elixirs.

I'll "un-stuck" it in the future. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Thanks guys.

You are right though, elixirs are last resort full heal items. If you need mana, potions and draughts are on cooldown, and you can't use focus due to being at a high difficulty, then you should use elixirs only then. Any other time is wasteful, as its a super potion and draught in one.

Is that an incorrect assumption on my part? Or should I just try to moderate elixirs?

See:

Don't be at all afraid to use elixirs, they're pretty much just as good as potions.

Without aiming for Capacitor in particular, mana elixirs are very nearly just as economical as mana potions, at least for me and other mages with similar stats:

https://forums.e-hentai.org/index.php?s=&am...t&p=4373591

(My stats:)
Potion: 29% of pool restored for cost + opportunity cost of (85 + 50) credits = 455 credits per full pool restored
Elixir: 89% of pool restored for cost + opportunity cost of (350 + 50) credits = 448 credits per full pool restored

If someone aims for a few levels of Capacitor in addition to Jug they might be able to widen that difference to something like 50 credits instead of being nearly the same.

For me, a potion restores 1397, and I have a pool of 4708, and I'd use an elixir at ~500 (10% for IA, rarely 10%-25% if I get Sparked during that time).
Potion: 29% of pool restored for 85 credits = 286 credits per full pool restored
Elixir: 89% of pool restored for 350 credits = 392 credits per full pool restored

With this (somewhat naive) view, it's a bit more expensive, but still similar.

You can also factor in the cost per turn: a good mage's income is 50 credits/turn. A better way of looking at it might be:
Potion: 29% of pool restored for cost + opportunity cost of (85 + 50) credits = 455 credits per full pool restored
Elixir: 89% of pool restored for cost + opportunity cost of (350 + 50) credits = 448 credits per full pool restored

Looking at it this way, using elixirs is very slightly better than potions, at least for someone with my MP boost (153%) and income. And I have only 3 Capacitor potencies on all my gear. If I got more, or if I leveled up more, or increased my clearing ability (more speed -> more c/turn), Elixirs would become even more profitable over potions.

Lower level players with less MP Tank from level proficiency would be slightly disadvantaged, but it's still more than fine. I'd say to use a potion whenever you feel like using a potion (or never, if you want) and using an elixir whenever your mana gets low, no matter which one you choose, the effect on your net worth in the end will be too similar to care about.

----

You should never have to buy a single mana potion/elixir/draught. If you're willing to grind, just drop your difficulty to nightmare/hell and use focus to regain mana when necessary.

No way, that's extremely inefficient. You have to take into account the opportunity cost of a turn as well, which for mage is high. I've checked the math a number of times, using consumables whenever you can is far better for your overall credits/turn than trying to be frugal.

Consider all income and expenses as completely fluid; it really helps for clearer thinking. (Income Summary is the best tool for this)

Sounds good.

It's completely wrong. (no offense)

Ah, math! My only weakness! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

My rationale was that I didn't want to buy anything at all (was poor when I did that, saved up over 500 draughts from that). Didn't have coupon clipper or think about the WTS either. There is also a case to be made for free draughts/potions given out for poorer players, which I probably should have used as well.

See:
----
No way, that's extremely inefficient. You have to take into account the opportunity cost of a turn as well, which for mage is high. I've checked the math a number of times, using consumables whenever you can is far better for your overall credits/turn than trying to be frugal.

Consider all income and expenses as completely fluid; it really helps for clearer thinking. (Income Summary is the best tool for this)
It's completely wrong. (no offense)

I think I'm leaning toward "conserving less" when it comes to mana elixirs.
I may be taking the "OMG! I have to use a mana elixir!" gasp! etc., a little too far when I play.
And your calculations are telling me I "am" taking it too far, if the cost is fairly the same.

tganimation's recommendation also fit in, because I never play above hell.
(So far, I find it near impossible to "survive" above hell as mage, but I'll buy my way out of that eventually. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) )

It might help you get accustomed to it by spending a whole battle series or few using only mana elixirs, and only using potions as backup. (Yeah, I know it feels odd)

It might help you get accustomed to it by spending a whole battle series or few using only mana elixirs, and only using potions as backup. (Yeah, I know it feels odd)

I'll need therapy afterwards.. but then it is therapy. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Just for the giggles, I'm going to force myself to do that.
65 round arenas and less so all the pain is in a few minutes at a time. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

Edit: Come to think of it.. they won't be long enough once it hits 35 or so.
OK.. Start at 150 and work my way back. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

This post has been edited by RoadShoe: Feb 13 2017, 05:27

So the difference between Dual Wielding and Two-Handed is the latter deal more damage? while the former have more defense + a chance to do half damage with a offhand weapon
Also is there that new day bonus still around? where you come on the next day it give you free exp?

This post has been edited by rynercall: Feb 13 2017, 08:40

So the difference between Dual Wielding and Two-Handed is the latter deal more damage? while the former have more defense + a chance to do half damage with a offhand weapon
Also is there that new day bonus still around? where you come on the next day it give you free exp?

DW does more damage to single targets, 2H does damage to multiple targets at once.

DW usually goes hand in hand with light armor. So it has higher evade, higher parry= uses less potions, gets hit less. 2-handed has splash damage, but due to the inherent weakness of 2-handed weapons having high burden/interference, they use more potions and have less action speed. Less evade and thus get hit more. For 2-handed, since you're already committing to the high burden and interference, you might as well go all the way and use power armor, a type of heavy armor that buffs attack damage. However, 2-handed is inferior to other playstyles currently available, like 1-handed Power Armor, which has countless benefits, with semi-perma Spirit Stance (which increases damage + reduces mana consumption when active), counter parry, which damages mobs when their attacks are successfully countered, and the best of all, Overwhelming Strikes, a proc that can stack which increases damage up to a stack of 5. The best melee style is thus said to be 1-handed Power Armor. However, I feel that for less invested players + poorer ones, DW Shade armor is just as good. Shade Armor is like Power Armor, it buffs Attack Damage, and has no interference or burden, meaning mana costs are reduced and you have higher action speed. However, a downside to it is that it has no piercing mitigation, which means if you do get hit by a piercing attack, you might suddenly lose half your hp bar. My recommendation is DW Light Armor for poor players or less invested ones, and only 1-handed for those who are able to get good Power Armor (Look at Equipment Ranges thread). All in all, read the wiki for more info: http://ehwiki.org/wiki/advice

Edit: @ryn

Dawn of a New Day can be triggered at the start of 0 UTC on the e-hentai News Page or any gallery page that you click on. It is helpful for giving you some exp that you can use, but otherwise not too necessary. It also resets all arenas and RoBs.

This post has been edited by tganimation6: Feb 13 2017, 09:12

I think it's a level thing with being below 400.
I don't really have mana usage under control just yet.

No, it's not a level thing, holy and dark mages can't be frugal with potions unless they really try hard at being frugal.
Even with peerless focus staff I'd be in the red (well, more or less, could break even with a bit of luck with gems) playing all PFUDOR arenas.
What helps me save potions are two thing mostly:

• Putting Drain in rotation in SG arenas
• Using aether shard

I honestly think that if you're an holy mage and you don't have deprecating prof maxed there is literally no reason not to put drain in rotation when doing SGs, it nearly has no impact on speed (2-3% on average from what I observed), saves you potions and increases depr prof for free.
On the other arenas is not that good though.
Aether shard is 10% mana conservation and last one hour, for 3k it's pretty good.

2-handed has splash damage, but due to the inherent weakness of 2-handed weapons having high burden/interference, they use more potions and have less action speed.

I honestly don't think that any sane mid-to-high-level 2H users (if there are any) would use elemental prefixes 2H weapon, it's either ethereal or nothing, since the burden will kill survivability even more (apart from FUS RO DAH style which only needs burder <40).
Also power heavy probably won't work outside of lower difficulties (no block, low parry and low evade together are a bit of suicide, even with heavy higher mitigations).

Yeah. Low action speed as well can be seen as an argument against the style, seeing as you get hit a lot more. However, seeing as that player is currently level 58, he has more room to experiment. At least, until he hits the first few spirit monsters.

I knew Drain had a Mana Drain augment, but is it really that significant? I always compared it to something like Bleeding Wound: does damage, but too little to be significant. If it gives back mana at a high enough rate, then I might try incorporating that into my DW as well, seeing as I need to grind another 20 prof for MagNet to be unlocked.

Yeah. Low action speed as well can be seen as an argument against the style, seeing as you get hit a lot more. However, seeing as that player is currently level 58, he has more room to experiment. At least, until he hits the first few spirit monsters.

At low leves more or less everything works just as good.
2H probably is even better than the other styles since it's at low levels is visibly faster and the defensive bonus of the other styles are not that great yet.

I knew Drain had a Mana Drain augment, but is it really that significant? I always compared it to something like Bleeding Wound: does damage, but too little to be significant. If it gives back mana at a high enough rate, then I might try incorporating that into my DW as well, seeing as I need to grind another 20 prof for MagNet to be unlocked.

No, you can't combine that with DW, if you read the description the mana drains only applies to enemies afflicted with Soul Fire, meaning it only applies to holy mages, all the other styles simply can't use it.
And well, I think the effect is pretty visible, but I recommend it only on SGs since the other monsters die too quickly for it to make any difference.
With SGs it's different since it's easier to proc if for the full 5 turns, which inflicts a visible amount of hp and mp theft. It's not as damaging as a T1 spell but, well, you get mana back and increase depr prof, what's there not to like?

all the other styles simply can't use it.

It's not that they can't it's just useless and inefficient nowadays, but back in the day when we had only 15 potions maximum many 1h users had a much harder time clearing SG arenas due to SGs' magic attacks quickly whittling down spirit, so many 1hers resorted to casting dark spells for spirit theft. Of course with unlimited potions it's a waste of time.