[X] My Assistant

Its nothing special.
staff, cap, robe, gloves, pants, shoes

And for 3+2 im using this cap. Besides that prof and 10% damage perks.

Are you imperiling 100% of mobs? Also do you need to use weaken? Because on pfudor I weaken every enemy first, then imperil strongest ones and then start casting. But it takes a lot of time so I'm not sure if it's worth doing it like that. But otherwise, without weaken, monsters just rape me.

Are you imperiling 100% of mobs? Also do you need to use weaken? Because on pfudor I weaken every enemy first, then imperil strongest ones and then start casting. But it takes a lot of time so I'm not sure if it's worth doing it like that. But otherwise, without weaken, monsters just rape me.

If you have to use Weaken to survive then you'd get a lot more credits/turn playing lower difficulty without Weaken. No mage should use Weaken if it's time efficiency they're concerned about.

Well, the peak result is probably closer to 15 packs/hour.

I have Crys5, and I don't like playing below PF because I'd run out of stamina, and I can get a little bit more than 3 packs/hour. Just did a couple runs, 2x300 rounds, 37k crystals ~= 92.5k, and stamina cost was 48k. Granted, my gear isn't astounding, but it doesn't look too good.

There was a time when Niten's damages were indexed on DW prof, not 2H :/.

The negate damage is the bleeding, actually. Been a lot of lvls I do more damages with bleeding wounds than my actual attack (normal attack, not SS or crit).

it takes a lot of time so I'm not sure if it's worth doing it like that. But otherwise, without weaken, monsters just rape me.

Its not very good idea. I use only imperil. Mage is much easier after 400 and specially 450 levels. They rape you probably because 4 things:

1. Hp pool. Jug rly helps to cure less and use less spirit pots. Its also main reason why leveling is good for mage. Even at my lvl i still have 20,3k and as i remember max is ~24k. Its quite solid potential.
2. Long rounds. If monster use mp attack then his overall damage jumps to 1,5x. Its very significant.
3. With high damage players oneshots many pf monsters. So even after first attack income damage already lower.
4. Cast speed. It works same as last 2, because monsters just cant use part of their attacks if they slower.

With time each of that disappears. Atm im using only ~20-30 cures (i think so, because its something like cure once per 4 roudns) for whole 100 round arena.

I think you know some players can clear pffest incredibly fast. They mostly doing it for exp, but income is just side effect of that.

This post has been edited by nec1986: Dec 4 2015, 17:42

A lot of legendary and magnificents both high and medium level equip in the bazaar. Someone overabused the trophies manipulation glitch i guess (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/duck.gif)

A lot of legendary and magnificents both high and medium level equip in the bazaar. Someone overabused the trophies manipulation glitch i guess (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/duck.gif)

What glitch?

I think my record was around 2 hours 45 minutes for 1000 rounds, though I didn't do it many times (too long). My gear wasn't excellent, but it was pretty decent.

Can you share the stats of that gear?

Actually, forget what i said.
I'll talk with Dan31 and see if it's a plausible theory and if it is we call Tenbo and we are done with it.

This post has been edited by Epion: Dec 4 2015, 19:14

Can you share the stats of that gear?

Legendary Demonic Rapier of the Nimble
Legendary Ruby Force Shield of Warding
Some 3 PAB Mag Power Slaughter Helmet
Magnificent Power Armor of Slaughter
Magnificent Power Gauntlets of Slaughter
Magnificent Power Leggings of Slaughter
Magnificent Power Boots of Slaughter

Also, WTS, anyone want any of these?

Actually, forget what i said.
I'll talk with Dan31 and see if it's a plausible theory and if it is we call Tenbo and we are done with it.

Probably unlikely. I frequently sell Mag/Leg gear anyway, it gets more return than salvaging sometimes.

There was a time when Niten's damages were indexed on DW prof, not 2H :/.

The negate damage is the bleeding, actually. Been a lot of lvls I do more damages with bleeding wounds than my actual attack (normal attack, not SS or crit).

Tch, bleed will be popular from now on.

The loss of PA proc really hurt, but skyward sword PA is actually a nice addition. If only there's some other way for niten style to negate damage mitigation or boost damage like PA proc or 1h Overpower, it might be better than 1h-heavy.

And actually, why not giving it one? given that niten is more like an advanced fighting style combining 2h and dw, making it better than basic 1h fighting style should be fine. That way the old katana-waki are rare weapons would be more justified.
And If 10b might consider it, this might be done by giving extra bonus to niten crits, making niten a "hit fast-crits hard-evade more" fighting style. For example a 50% physical mitigation reduction effect (2PA stack) that calculated when the crits happen will be helpful.

just FYI, it's been reported that niten works decently with Dovahkiin's FRD skill. but i cannot give you more details about this (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif)

Now then... Yesterday i didn't have the time and today i was not in the mood to put up the calculations, so i'm just gonna give the results.
If anyone wants the formulas i used, i can give you everything since it's actually nothing complicated, but still long, so i'm not doing it right now simply cause i'm not in the mood to make a very long post (not feeling very good right now actually).

Imperil when used for melee style on all monsters.

Does it speed up your clear?
Yes.

How much?
There is no way in hell i can give a real reply, since the variations are waaaaaaaaaay too many.

However by giving a realistic approximation we can narrow it down to:

1H savage style: 0.7 to 1.1 times faster.
1H crit style: 1.4 to 1.8 times faster.
DW high power style: 0.9 to 1.2 times faster.
DW high crit style: 1.1 to 1.3 times faster.


In other words, high attack damage builds can even get slower clears by mass imperil usage, while high crit chance builds have most of the time faster clears.

Now... is this method worth the trouble?
Depends.
High imperil usage with melee style devastates one's mana draughts supplies that have to be running 24/24.
If one wants to speed up his clear and doesn't have the credits or interest to get a slaughter set (yet... cause after a point you have to), then it can help to speed up things.

Frankly speaking?
NO!
Not worth. Why?
One cause it cost too much on consumables.
Two cause you get crabs to try and go Alt+2 - 2 - Alt+2 - 5, etc (i keep imperil on the second slot for the quickbar, so Alt+2 activates it and so i don't lose any time to activate it).
For the rest, there are more positive results than negative, so if what is important is the clear speed only, then, go for it.

Many thanks to Scremaz, Bee and Binga for the help.
---
(Superlatanium, i forgot you are also a scripter, so i send you a pm for the other matter, that way i don't bother Dan as well.)

This post has been edited by Epion: Dec 4 2015, 19:38

Actually, forget what i said.
I'll talk with Dan31 and see if it's a plausible theory and if it is we call Tenbo and we are done with it.

pls share this when you guys are done (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

Imperil when used for melee style on all monsters.

So,even if a use rapier,imperil will speed up my cleaning speed?cuz i don't need to stack armor pen?

So,even if a use rapier,imperil will speed up my cleaning speed?cuz i don't need to stack armor pen?

this is what i observed:

25 rounds of PF-fest in both cases.
no use of random features like Spirit Stance. basically, i only used usual IA spells (Haste, Spirit Shield and Shadow Veil) + Protection and Regen.
DW, Light and Supportive prof capped. Deprecating at 243 prior start using Imperil.
Wind Spike Shield with Elec strike rapier. Hallowed waki so i slotted Holy Imperil too. same ability tree in both cases, obviously (inparticular, all relevent abilities maxed).
eventual Channellings were used either for these spells, Heartseeker (in 2nd case) Imperil (in 3rd case) or let go. OC simply lost in both cases.

1: w/o Imperil, w/o Heartseeker: 1590 turns. crit stats = 50.6%/+78% (base)

2: w/o Imperil, with Heartseeker: 1361 turns. crit stats = 60.6%/+92% (if i read wiki correctly)

3: with Imperil, w/o Heartseeker: 1413 turns. crit stats = base? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) 47 APs burnt like it was nothing (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) Imperil costed 62 MP and lasted 24 turns (34 with Channelling), so plenty of room to kill more than one mob with the same Imperil. also, *every* mob had been imperiled before being shot.

4: with Imperil, with Heartseeker: not available. i expect to reach something like 1250~1300 turns or so though.

no problems with PA stacking, up to 3x with relative ease. it seems that Imperil have quite a good effect, comparable to Heartseeker in fact.
still, it's quite long/tedious/boring, so i'd suggest you to go with Heartseeker and SS on as much as possible (which is my favorite way of playing, btw. berserk mode FTW (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cool.gif) )

quite small pool, i know. but i tend to grow bored pretty quickly. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

however, personally i think that melees should be happy enough with Heartseeker - and consider i wasn't even using Spirit Stance nor OFC/FRD. if nothing else, because it gives you better results with a feeble fraction of the effort. obviously, feel free to prove me i'm wrong (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

pls share this when you guys are done (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

Keep in mind that it's mostly a joke i made based on a theory i have. So don't expect anything (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

this is what i observed:

[indent][/indent]

quite small pool, i know. but i tend to grow bored pretty quickly. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

however, personally i think that melees should be happy enough with Heartseeker - and consider i wasn't even using Spirit Stance nor OFC/FRD. if nothing else, because it gives you better results with a feeble fraction of the effort. obviously, feel free to prove me i'm wrong (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

That.
(Though in my results i did calculate an OFC formula of course, the delay to rebuild OP and Spirit stance of course).

So,even if a use rapier,imperil will speed up my cleaning speed?cuz i don't need to stack armor pen?

Of course, but keep in mind that armor pen is better than imperil and free on your weapon.
But they do add one to the other (multiplicatively unfortunately), and imperil has immediate effect, while pen has to be stacked.
At your level however i would not go for this method. It's something for 310+ level (or better 330+) when you get the best imperil effects from ability training.

This post has been edited by Epion: Dec 4 2015, 19:58

the game itself is boring, we want to laugh as well (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif)

meanwhile, for whoever may want to be a little happier than before:

Now then... Yesterday i didn't have the time and today i was not in the mood to put up the calculations, so i'm just gonna give the results.
If anyone wants the formulas i used, i can give you everything since it's actually nothing complicated, but still long, so i'm not doing it right now simply cause i'm not in the mood to make a very long post (not feeling very good right now actually).

Imperil when used for melee style on all monsters.

Does it speed up your clear?
Yes.

How much?
There is no way in hell i can give a real reply, since the variations are waaaaaaaaaay too many.

However by giving a realistic approximation we can narrow it down to:

1H savage style: 0.7 to 1.1 times faster.
1H crit style: 1.4 to 1.8 times faster.
DW high power style: 0.9 to 1.2 times faster.
DW high crit style: 1.1 to 1.3 times faster.
In other words, high attack damage builds can even get slower clears by mass imperil usage, while high crit chance builds have most of the time faster clears.

Now... is this method worth the trouble?
Depends.
High imperil usage with melee style devastates one's mana draughts supplies that have to be running 24/24.
If one wants to speed up his clear and doesn't have the credits or interest to get a slaughter set (yet... cause after a point you have to), then it can help to speed up things.

Frankly speaking?
NO!
Not worth. Why?
One cause it cost too much on consumables.
Two cause you get crabs to try and go Alt+2 - 2 - Alt+2 - 5, etc (i keep imperil on the second slot for the quickbar, so Alt+2 activates it and so i don't lose any time to activate it).
For the rest, there are more positive results than negative, so if what is important is the clear speed only, then, go for it.

Many thanks to Scremaz, Bee and Binga for the help.
---
(Superlatanium, i forgot you are also a scripter, so i send you a pm for the other matter, that way i don't bother Dan as well.)

I'm not quite understand the math behind this O xO

Theoretically speaking, high crit build should proc PA more often, thus making imperil less of an impact to your damage. That copes with less extra work per round (to imperil) should make it less imperil-dependant than attack damage focus build (assuming both set are equal) when it comes to clear speed O xO It's the attack focus build which has lower PA proc and higher elemental strike that should benefit the most with imperil O xO

Also you should mention how many turns on average it took to finish 1 monster. If your attack is on the low side then imperil would have a better effect, but if it only takes 6 7 turns to kill 1 then it just not worth debuffing at all O xO

That 6 7 turns on average is my 1h statistic, and you all know I'm still using exquisite rapier with crappy lv250 superior power armors O xO I do have almost 100% spirit stance and about 80% heartserker uptime though (cuz I don't wanna waste mana casting heartserker without channeling Q xQ)

Actually I forgot to take counter damage into consideration. If monster is at full hp then it's more like 8 10 turns each.

This post has been edited by Nekokon: Dec 4 2015, 20:20

(Though in my results i did calculate an OFC formula of course, the delay to rebuild OP and Spirit stance of course).

the delay to rebuild OC isn't as big as one may think - 15 turns? and only if you want to completely refill the bar. if you only want to re-switch it on for the surplus damage, reaching 100-150 is more than enough.
either way, if you are tanky enough you will only see a little less damage for a handful of turns.

if you even count in OFC, then you should differentiate whether you completely empty your OC bar or not after having casted it: if you reach 0 OC, then rebuilding it (even at its fullest) is quite quick. if there is a bit of OC remaining, then you may need 2 or 3 rounds to replenish it without switching it off.