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post Feb 14 2015, 06:43
Post #62741
Superlatanium



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QUOTE(trutta @ Feb 14 2015, 03:58) *

You are entirely correct, but around low levels and up to 130/140ish it actually works rather splendid (it's 50 turns of near invincibility) and especially while supportive is too low to be useful. Just use a pot every 50 turn and this stage can be almost completely overpowered (the clue is to stay at max hp when your mana/supportive proficiency isn't sufficient to achieve the same effect) while tossing on exp, proficiency and ability points. It's far from a perfect solution, but it enables lowbies with crap equips and all that to run at very high difficulty without bothering with all that dying stuff.

If 10% of base health per turn (with health potion) is really enough for "near invincibility" then you might as well just use Regen (gives 10% per turn with level 95 ability point). It'll give you the exact same effect with a little less duration, but it'll cost 1/4th or less of an inventory slot (worth of mana) instead of a whole inventory slot. You could also very likely increase the difficulty by one or even two steps if the monsters don't make a dent with only 10% base regen. I remember dying to a pathetic Blue Slime back when I was around level 70 because I had used half health / half mana pots instead of all mana pots, and ran out of mana during a ~30 round arena. I wouldn't want that to happen to others.

Even without any supportive proficiency you'll find regen + mana pot more efficient than health pots - letting you play on higher difficulties longer. Still, if you're only playing those battle series which don't require efficiency, like First Blood / Learning Curves / Graduation / Crude IW / Ring of Blood, then go ahead and use health pots if you want, since you'll finish anyway (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

A related problem is heavy armor. Those using heavy armor at low levels will have a lot of interference in addition to having low proficiency, so buff durations are low and costly. Mana's still better than health pots, but the number of rounds you can clear is probably significantly lower than with Leather (or shade) armor due to running out of mana. I kind of wish I could go back to level 150ish to test it out, but I'm still inclined to recommend leather armor for everyone until their supportive proficiency is high enough to decrease costs/increase duration sufficiently to make heavy armor viable - maybe 175 proficiency? I'm not quite sure.
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post Feb 14 2015, 06:50
Post #62742
ChanForu



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I used to be a big fan of the spam health potions thing at lower levels but mana potions are in retrospect several times more efficient.
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post Feb 14 2015, 07:22
Post #62743
maaw



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Hey everybody!
I'm here to really pump you for knowledge. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I hope I'm not breaking any unwritten rule by asking so many questions at once, if so I'm terribly sorry.

(First you might want to see below for general stats on my guy.)

I'm still very much a Noob still and know little about the game overall. I'm not totally ignorant I have read most of the Wiki and little on the forums but mostly superficially, definitely no complete combat equations (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

1. My main question is should I mix in some leather in my armor (if they have better stats and maybe also prefixes and for cheaper upgrades(?, no need for shade crystals)) and not be so fixated on burden?
(the Free Shop have lot of legendary leather just know they hand out for donations and I think I have some stuff I don't really need, which they would accept for donation)

2.Should I take steps to reduce my interference more since i use defensive spells a lot and depreciating on bosses and random encounters, which is the only place where i use IWBTH difficulty. (lower otherwise Nintendo/Hell mostly.)

3. Which of my equipment is weakest for me i.e which should i focus on replacing with better?

4. Are my primary stats unbalanced? Should I not care so much about the 25 bonuses for agility for example and are my speed bonus based on "agility - level" maxed out at the moment?

5. Have I trained sensibly and if not what should I focus more and less on?

6. On difficulty I play with the highest I think I can get away with but I have been beaten on the last/second last round a few times which is frustrating in the arena or item world ( It is getting less common for me at least (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) ). Should I continue this way or should I play on lower or much lower difficulty especially on some types of matches?

7. Should my main focus be on leveling my new main weapon and can I influence what bonuses it gets on leveling?

8. I'm also mildly thinking of switching to 1H for better protection and counter attacks, would that be wise considering my playing style (kinda speedy turtle, see below for more detail) and game balance in general?


Stats

Equipment
Main Hand
Off Hand
Helmet
Body
Hands
Legs
Feets

Stats Attached ImageTrainingAttached Image

Battle items is 2-3 spirit potions maybe 1 health and all the rest is mana.
I have haste and shadow vale on auto cast, fully upgraded for my level as pretty much everything I use.

My playing style (when facing strong monsters) is primary defense and speed (block+evade+buffs and Spark of Life for lucky one shotters) and keep enemy slow and asleep and attack with spirit stance and overcharge special attacks (iris strike back-stab) when I'm well protected.

As I said I was really going to pump you on information hard! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) Sorry for that but I hope I have made my post as readable as possible and provided you with all the information you need to help me.

If you don't have the time i appreciate any answers even if it's only on one or few of my many, many questions (sorry for that again. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) )

Really thank you for your time and hopefully for some great advice (no pressure (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)). (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

I'm not a native speakers so I apologize for the spelling and grammatical errors I have probably made and the length of the post.

If something is unclear or you need more information please ask.

(And if anyone wonders how I become so relatively rich for my level. Running a decent H@TH server 24/7 is a pretty good way to earn credits, a great way is offering sexual favors (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) )

Kind Regards maaw
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post Feb 14 2015, 08:15
Post #62744
Superlatanium



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QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 05:22) *
..

That's quite a wakizashi! Normally I wouldn't recommend those because they're dead last in terms of weapon damage, but the stats of yours are amazing so it's not bad. Still, soon you'll be running into monsters with PL much higher than you do now (eg. PL 700+ monsters compared to the current ~PL 200 you're probably fighting), so you may wish to get a mainhand weapon with Stun (club) to reduce the amount of damage taken a bit. Bleed is useless. (Clubs also have high weapon damage) Still, that's up to you, and if the monsters you fight now don't seem dangerous enough for that then don't worry about it.

I'd avoid Arcanist if I were you, since the intel stat is useless for non-mages, and the reduced interference doesn't really make up for what you could potentially be getting with a more useful suffix.

Some of your armor is lacking all the potential light PABS (str dex end agi), but that's not really a huge problem by itself - but you do at least need both decent strength and endurance. (all but helmet have mediocre or nonexistent endurance, which is probably causing you some problems)

I'm not a Light armor expert, but I'd recommend either mostly or all leather, or all shade. The less burden you have, the more influential each point of it is, so going from 0 to 3.5 burden has a significantly higher impact on evade than going from 36.5 to 40. Are you trying for an evade-based build? That's what Shade is for usually, I think. If you aren't trying for an evade-based build then you could try all basic leather (or mostly leather) and see if you perform better, but I wouldn't worry about it much.

Only spend special materials (Shade Fragment) on equipment that's at least worth a few times more than the value of the special material and upgrade cost. No use spending 40k+ upgrading a piece worth 5k at the Bazaar.

Intentionally reducing interference is pretty difficult, since the other stats such as attack damage, evade, endurance, and strength are more important, so after narrowing down the best gear for your price range, interference is too low of a priority to come much into play.

If I were you, I'd hold off on looking for armor upgrades for now. Soon (between levels 150-200) you'll start fighting much stronger monsters, and you may find that light armor without top tier evade just isn't giving you enough defensive power. You may decide to switch to 1h/heavy, the most popular and most effective melee style at the moment. (1h/shade is also an option, but it's trickier. ask Screamaz about that. you may need a large budget for Emax+ evade on all equips and a great shield) I tried using Shade until level 250 or so, and it was much much more painful than it could have been had I tried 1h/heavy earlier.

Your allocated stats are fine and balanced enough. You don't have to worry about the loot based trainings if you don't want - even with all loot training maxed, you're unlikely to find much unless you're level 400+ and play 500+ rounds every day (which is where 99% of equipment used in HV comes from, I think). Proficiency training is useless. Adept Learner is still quite cheap for you, so you might want to upgrade it at least until it costs 3k or so.
QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 05:22) *
6. On difficulty I play with the highest I think I can get away with but I have been beaten on the last/second last round a few times which is frustrating in the arena or item world ( It is getting less common for me at least (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) ). Should I continue this way or should I play on lower or much lower difficulty especially on some types of matches?

Experience is more important than completion (as long as you aren't doing IW) If you play 65 rounds of a 70 round arena and die, that's better than playing 70/70 rounds at a lower difficulty, even if dying doesn't feel good.
QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 05:22) *
7. Should my main focus be on leveling my new main weapon and can I influence what bonuses it gets on leveling?

Item world takes too long for those below ~250. Also, you might soon decide to try changing your weapon to something else like a club or rapier with 1h, so I'd hold off on making a big decision for now. Also know that item world is worth 200k-400k or so, so the equipment needs to be good enough in the first place to justify that cost (or the equivalent cost in time, even if you do it yourself).
QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 05:22) *
My playing style (when facing strong monsters) is primary defense and speed (block+evade+buffs and Spark of Life for lucky one shotters) and keep enemy slow and asleep and attack with spirit stance and overcharge special attacks (iris strike back-stab) when I'm well protected.

Sleep is pretty mana-intensive, and Slow is unnecessary if you use Silence. After all, the special MP or SP attacks are the ones that actually do a significant amount of damage - everything else usually does too little to even consider.
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post Feb 14 2015, 09:06
Post #62745
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QUOTE(Superlatanium @ Feb 14 2015, 07:43) *

If 10% of base health per turn (with health potion) is really enough for "near invincibility" then you might as well just use Regen (gives 10% per turn with level 95 ability point). It'll give you the exact same effect with a little less duration, but it'll cost 1/4th or less of an inventory slot (worth of mana) instead of a whole inventory slot. You could also very likely increase the difficulty by one or even two steps if the monsters don't make a dent with only 10% base regen. I remember dying to a pathetic Blue Slime back when I was around level 70 because I had used half health / half mana pots instead of all mana pots, and ran out of mana during a ~30 round arena. I wouldn't want that to happen to others.

Even without any supportive proficiency you'll find regen + mana pot more efficient than health pots - letting you play on higher difficulties longer. Still, if you're only playing those battle series which don't require efficiency, like First Blood / Learning Curves / Graduation / Crude IW / Ring of Blood, then go ahead and use health pots if you want, since you'll finish anyway (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

A related problem is heavy armor. Those using heavy armor at low levels will have a lot of interference in addition to having low proficiency, so buff durations are low and costly. Mana's still better than health pots, but the number of rounds you can clear is probably significantly lower than with Leather (or shade) armor due to running out of mana. I kind of wish I could go back to level 150ish to test it out, but I'm still inclined to recommend leather armor for everyone until their supportive proficiency is high enough to decrease costs/increase duration sufficiently to make heavy armor viable - maybe 175 proficiency? I'm not quite sure.


Yes, I am very much aware that mana is utterly versatile and superior compared to just health alone for one item slot. What I'm talking about is more to be regarded as a 'cheesy' tactic, a way to sidestep the many limitations that would otherwise inhibit a new player while enduring those lower levels. Although I must say I have somewhat limited experience with the game as I play on and off, but here is what I arrived at:

By using heroic health pots and regen/haste/protection you only need mana for the occasional heal (i.e. when several skills/spells hits in the same round) and the recasting of regen. Scroll of the Avatar gives haste and protection with double normal duration, and in this way you can load up on power armor for damage without worrying too much about the interference. This makes for a slightly unstable tank that would normally lead to certain death after x amount of rounds, but this is where the finishing touch comes into play - the stun and domino strike of the mace, which normally stabilizes the whole thing rather nicely.

I arrived at this 'backwards' approach when fiddeling around at level 25ish with a 1H/shield/leather armor, but kept dying because proficiencies and equipment were just about equally crappy - I looked for a way to just have to buff myself and then idly bash at the keyboard for 50 turns. For just grabbing proficiencies/levels/ability points it works great, as the monsters usually end up stunned after a couple rounds while soaking in the damage from all that power armor. It sacrifices almost all defense and versatility for high damage, lots of stun and all those proficiencies you would normally gain by casting spells and playing 'normally'.

It works very well up until a certain point, when a more conventional way, with it's safer and more versatile approach, outpaces it as the style must necessarily adopt to higher level challanges. (If you're going to have to heal and pay attention to stay alive you might aswell reap the benefits of a conventional approach, and at this point swap to a more conventional tactic.)

It would be interesting to compare this approach with others to see how the numbers pan out. (It is entirely possible that it's not very much better when using the right gear combinations and a refined combat strategy, but it's certainly alot easier if someone is just starting out and don't have access to all of that right off the bat.)
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post Feb 14 2015, 11:02
Post #62746
clarkiest



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Offering different opinion
QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 07:22) *
1. My main question is should I mix in some leather in my armor (if they have better stats and maybe also prefixes and for cheaper upgrades(?, no need for shade crystals)) and not be so fixated on burden?

2.Should I take steps to reduce my interference more since i use defensive spells a lot and depreciating on bosses and random encounters, which is the only place where i use IWBTH difficulty. (lower otherwise Nintendo/Hell mostly.)

3. Which of my equipment is weakest for me i.e which should i focus on replacing with better?

4. Are my primary stats unbalanced? Should I not care so much about the 25 bonuses for agility for example and are my speed bonus based on "agility - level" maxed out at the moment?

5. Have I trained sensibly and if not what should I focus more and less on?

6. On difficulty I play with the highest I think I can get away with but I have been beaten on the last/second last round a few times which is frustrating in the arena or item world ( It is getting less common for me at least (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) ). Should I continue this way or should I play on lower or much lower difficulty especially on some types of matches?

7. Should my main focus be on leveling my new main weapon and can I influence what bonuses it gets on leveling?

8. I'm also mildly thinking of switching to 1H for better protection and counter attacks, would that be wise considering my playing style (kinda speedy turtle, see below for more detail) and game balance in general?
Stats

Basically, if you don't need cure too often, it's fine. If you need too many cure, something hasn't been right with your equipments. It can be your defense or your offense: Not hardy enough to receive regular blow or not fast enough to kill mobs before they do special attack. Improve your gears organically (read: mix stuffs, try new weapons, or try new playstyle), but hold back on forging until you just can't afford replacing anymore. This implies that it's fine to mix shade with leather (1).

Know first about your survival, what is the highest difficulty you can fight without depending on deprecating spell. If you feel your survival too low, improve your offense and defense first (3). This means reducing interference is not crucial (2).

Stat is fine (4). Training is fine (5), but hold back on loot until you're confident with your equipment. Token is nice, try to get them (6). At your defense stat, good luck IW-ing those nice weapons (7). High 1H proficiency allows you to face only 2 or 3 opponent at once because everyone else is stunned, which improve your survivability. 1H is slow on low difficulty, but the only viable style on high. If you plan to always challenging high difficulty, please do (8). But do note that at your level, loot improvement is negligible compared to extra time spent finishing it.
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post Feb 14 2015, 15:27
Post #62747
Cleavs



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QUOTE(Colman @ Feb 14 2015, 03:50) *

Minor correction. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

so, even the crit bonus from heartseeker is addictive? interesting.

QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 06:22) *

1. My main question is should I mix in some leather in my armor (if they have better stats and maybe also prefixes and for cheaper upgrades(?, no need for shade crystals)) and not be so fixated on burden?
(the Free Shop have lot of legendary leather just know they hand out for donations and I think I have some stuff I don't really need, which they would accept for donation)

shade HAS to be fixated about burden, because it lowers your evade - which is one of the main points in using shade. however a couple of points is still bearable.
if you have trouble surviving then mix a leather of protection with high PMI/PABs. otherwise, continue this way

QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 06:22) *

2.Should I take steps to reduce my interference more since i use defensive spells a lot and depreciating on bosses and random encounters, which is the only place where i use IWBTH difficulty. (lower otherwise Nintendo/Hell mostly.)

nah, simply cast spells in spirit stance as much as possible. also, defensive spells should be casted before offensive ones, especially at high difficulties

QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 06:22) *

3. Which of my equipment is weakest for me i.e which should i focus on replacing with better?

main hand. try to search for a rapier. also breastplate, if you really want to go with arcanist (which is not that bad of a choice given the WIS bonus) go with a better quality one, possibly with all 6 PABs

QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 06:22) *

4. Are my primary stats unbalanced? Should I not care so much about the 25 bonuses for agility for example and are my speed bonus based on "agility - level" maxed out at the moment?

raise END and WIs more. END pretty much like STR, WIS maybe a little less - but increasing your HP/MP pools is always good

QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 06:22) *

5. Have I trained sensibly and if not what should I focus more and less on?

more adept learner and don't waste credits on assimilator anymore. also, keep high-level trainings (like luck of the draw) for when you'll have more credits

QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 06:22) *

6. On difficulty I play with the highest I think I can get away with but I have been beaten on the last/second last round a few times which is frustrating in the arena or item world ( It is getting less common for me at least (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) ). Should I continue this way or should I play on lower or much lower difficulty especially on some types of matches?

as you approach the end you should increase your protection layers to be sure to bring home the result. this includes (but it's not limited to) cast haste, regen, protection, shadow veil (provided you already didn't do it) and even spark if needed. also, you may want to try the combo rapier of slaughter + wakizashi of nimble to boost both damage and parry: no worry about changing the offhand suffix, since bleeding wound isn't so useful anyways, so no big trouble if your offhand is less than now

QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 06:22) *

7. Should my main focus be on leveling my new main weapon and can I influence what bonuses it gets on leveling?

that leg waki is nice, but it's not so useful in this current build.
IW at your level isn't suggested because the efforts you should put aren't worth the result. also, you can't decide which potencies will come out, but you can still choose whether to accept them or not by resetting via amnesia shards. it's quite expensive of a solution though, so be careful.

QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 06:22) *

8. I'm also mildly thinking of switching to 1H for better protection and counter attacks, would that be wise considering my playing style (kinda speedy turtle, see below for more detail) and game balance in general?

1H is highly suggested past level 170~200. for now you can still stick with DW

QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 06:22) *

My playing style (when facing strong monsters) is primary defense and speed (block+evade+buffs and Spark of Life for lucky one shotters) and keep enemy slow and asleep and attack with spirit stance and overcharge special attacks (iris strike back-stab) when I'm well protected.

you have to do this way because your damage is quite low due to dual wakizashi. try rapier (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

QUOTE(maaw @ Feb 14 2015, 06:22) *

a great way is offering sexual favors (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

this is interesting. pm me if you are a busty girl and live near italy (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)
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post Feb 14 2015, 16:19
Post #62748
Colman



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QUOTE(Scremaz @ Feb 14 2015, 21:27) *

so, even the crit bonus from heartseeker is addictive? interesting.

I can't be sure for that one.
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post Feb 14 2015, 16:21
Post #62749
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So. After some runs with crystal x5 perk hellfest still not very profitably in current speed (2.5h for full clear). Its more or less near 100-140k profit, but per hour amount isnt very high. F.e. only trophies from schoolgirls cost almost 40k and it req only 30-40 minutes on normal.

Its better to increase speed fist and only after that buy crystal perks.
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post Feb 14 2015, 19:00
Post #62750
crute



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Or learn from some asians and use dark technology :X I can't imagine live beings using hundreds of minutes of infusions (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)
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post Feb 14 2015, 23:25
Post #62751
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Oshiete HV sensei's! How do you play last 3 arenas on PFUDOR with 1H? Is it better to use spark against spirit shield / weaken against silence? Do you use imperil with rapier?

My current set is defensive (4132 ABD, 73.2% PM, 67.3% MM, 46.2% block, 44.5% parry), usually I play with spirit shield and regen my spirit with ragnarok/drain, but I believe its ineffective without 7+ enemies....
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post Feb 14 2015, 23:38
Post #62752
Cleavs



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QUOTE(Benny-boy @ Feb 14 2015, 22:25) *

Oshiete HV sensei's! How do you play last 3 arenas on PFUDOR with 1H? Is it better to use spark against spirit shield / weaken against silence? Do you use imperil with rapier?

My current set is defensive (4132 ABD, 73.2% PM, 67.3% MM, 46.2% block, 44.5% parry), usually I play with spirit shield and regen my spirit with ragnarok/drain, but I believe its ineffective without 7+ enemies....

you can do the first one with IW10 ethereal rapier + power of slaughter + 8MP/2SP potions + infusion of darkness in 30 minutes: spirit shield mandatory, protection + fire spikes very useful, spark/imperil/weaken not needed. silence only when you earn a channeling and every other spell (including ragnarok) has already been casted - basically never; some scrolls of absorption may be useful as well, but only at the end

my stats are 5667 ADB, 65.2% PMI, 64.3% MMI, 53% block, 43% parry. and yes, regenerating spirit via siphoning isn't so effective on long runs

for the other two i guess you really need max pack rat...
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post Feb 14 2015, 23:45
Post #62753
Benny-boy



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QUOTE(Scremaz @ Feb 14 2015, 23:38) *

you can do the first one with IW10 ethereal rapier + power of slaughter + 8MP/2SP potions + infusion of darkness in 30 minutes: spirit shield mandatory, protection + fire spikes very useful, spark/imperil/weaken not needed. silence only when you earn a channeling and every other spell (including ragnarok) has already been casted - basically never; some scrolls of absorption may be useful as well, but only at the end

my stats are 5667 ADB, 65.2% PMI, 64.3% MMI, 53% block, 43% parry. and yes, regenerating spirit via siphoning isn't so effective on long runs

for the other two i guess you really need max pack rat...


I have IW10 ethereal rapier/max pack rat, looking for optimal way to do it. Why spirit shield is mandatory?

QUOTE(Scremaz @ Feb 14 2015, 23:38) *
and yes, regenerating spirit via siphoning isn't so effective on long runs


its effective for The Trio and the Tree PFUDOR arena/IWBTH IW

This post has been edited by Benny-boy: Feb 14 2015, 23:49
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post Feb 14 2015, 23:50
Post #62754
Cleavs



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QUOTE(Benny-boy @ Feb 14 2015, 22:45) *

I have IW10 ethereal rapier/max pack rat, looking for optimal way to do it. Why spirit shield is mandatory?

because at our levels there are a lot of celestials/sprites/other similar beasts and they can hit pretty hard: tsukiko tsutsukikake-whatever can deal void attacks on par with FSM and eat away 130 SP, which means around 16k HP. similarly for some celestials and SG's dark attacks.

can i see your rapier, btw?

QUOTE(Benny-boy @ Feb 14 2015, 22:45) *

its effective for The Trio and the Tree PFUDOR arena/IWBTH IW

yes, but it's really slow. also, you have to deal with SG which have a shitton on HP, and while you attack them it's quite likely they recharge their SP bars, so better to spare your MP for something else. i also tried with 10MP, infusions, no SP and only siphoning, but i wasn't able to end the quest

This post has been edited by Scremaz: Feb 14 2015, 23:59
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post Feb 14 2015, 23:55
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Superlatanium



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QUOTE(Benny-boy @ Feb 14 2015, 21:25) *
Oshiete HV sensei's! How do you play last 3 arenas on PFUDOR with 1H?

I would say just don't, because they take too long (unless all your equipment is excellent) and they don't give as much experience or credits per time as the standard 70-100 round arenas. But if you want to, then
QUOTE(Benny-boy @ Feb 14 2015, 21:25) *
Is it better to use spark against spirit shield / weaken against silence? Do you use imperil with rapier?

I'd use both Spark and Spirit Shield. Especially when there are many monsters, even at 100% health, 5 SP attacks can still kill you if you don't have Spark (fewer if you're holding down a number key to attack and don't release the button until a turn later). But Spirit Shield is still very useful for keeping high-powered attacks do a relatively low amount of damage to your HP - it lets you rely just on Regen more - fewer Cures needed, and you can Spirit Theft whatever spirit you lose after a few rounds.

3-target Weaken costs 15, and 3-target Silence costs 18. But, Silence almost eliminates damage taken, while Weaken only halves it. So I'd try to just use Silence, and maybe use Weaken if the Silence doesn't connect (and if Shield Bash is not usable) - but Weaken still usually isn't necessary.

If your mitigations/block/max HP are high enough, you might be able to play DwD without Silence or Weaken at all, but I doubt that's doable without top-notch equipment.

Imperil is almost useless when the target also has Penetrated Armor, especially with 3 stacks of PA, so I'd avoid Imperil.

Especially for DwD, I strongly recommend an OFC set. At the start of every schoolgirl round you can use it, and you don't need to tank many ordinary monster hits for 20-40 turns until they're dead like you do without OFC.
QUOTE(Benny-boy @ Feb 14 2015, 21:25) *
My current set is defensive (4132 ABD, 73.2% PM, 67.3% MM, 46.2% block, 44.5% parry), usually I play with spirit shield and regen my spirit with ragnarok/drain, but I believe its ineffective without 7+ enemies....

You can probably afford to go more offensive. My level is only slightly higher than yours but I can do DwD with 64 pmit / 61 mmit without much trouble.

Ragnarok is expensive. It's the most cost-efficient spell only when there are 1-3 monsters - otherwise, use Disintegrate instead, for a more efficient chance of a Ripened Soul proc per mana used. Want the math?
QUOTE(Scremaz @ Feb 14 2015, 21:38) *
my stats are 5667 ADB, 65.2% PMI, 64.3% MMI, 53% block, 43% parry. and yes, regenerating spirit via siphoning isn't so effective on long runs

for the other two i guess you really need max pack rat...

Sure spirit regen can be efficient, if the alternative is running out of spirit potions and dying on round 100.
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post Feb 15 2015, 00:06
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QUOTE(Superlatanium @ Feb 14 2015, 22:55) *

I would say just don't, because they take too long (unless all your equipment is excellent) and they don't give as much experience or credits per time as the standard 70-100 round arenas.

oh, yes. obviously SG are to do at low difficulties only for farming trophies/tokens, but it seems he really wants to go that path...

QUOTE(Superlatanium @ Feb 14 2015, 22:55) *

3-target Weaken costs 15, and 3-target Silence costs 18. But, Silence almost eliminates damage taken, while Weaken only halves it. So I'd try to just use Silence, and maybe use Weaken if the Silence doesn't connect (and if Shield Bash is not usable) - but Weaken still usually isn't necessary.

do you rely so much on deprecating spells/special skills? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

QUOTE(Superlatanium @ Feb 14 2015, 22:55) *

Especially for DwD, I strongly recommend an OFC set. At the start of every schoolgirl round you can use it, and you don't need to tank many ordinary monster hits for 20-40 turns until they're dead like you do without OFC.

ditto.

QUOTE(Superlatanium @ Feb 14 2015, 22:55) *

Ragnarok is expensive. It's the most cost-efficient spell only when there are 1-3 monsters - otherwise, use Disintegrate instead, for a more efficient chance of a Ripened Soul proc per mana used. Want the math?

mmm... usually i cast forbidden only on high number of mobs to maximize the effect, i guess i'd give disintegrate a try. too lazy to train 8 APs though (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)


btw, who may be interested in an economizer 4/archmage 2 demonic staff of destruction? i'm IWing it just for the lulz and it's going pretty well
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post Feb 15 2015, 00:08
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QUOTE(Scremaz @ Feb 14 2015, 23:50) *

because at our levels there are a lot of celestials/sprites/other similar beasts and they can hit pretty hard: tsukiko tsutsukikake-whatever can deal void attacks on par with FSM and eat away 130 SP, which means around 16k HP. similarly for some celestials and SG's dark attacks.

can i see your rapier, btw?
yes, but it's really slow. also, you have to deal with SG which have a shitton on HP, and while you attack them it's quite likely they recharge their SP bars, so better to spare your MP for something else. i also tried with 10MP, infusions, no SP and only siphoning, but i wasn't able to end the quest


Thats why spark may be good with weaken.

Modest Rapier of Laziness

It may be slow for speedranners, but with my pc/connection/slow playstyle its reasonable. I use it when they stunned, but cant say much about many SG. And its nice chance for extra heal/damage reduction. How much SP do you use for these arenas? Do you use Shadow Veil?

P.S. Why everyone is so afraid of tsukiko tsutsukikake? IMHO its average mob.
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post Feb 15 2015, 00:21
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QUOTE(Benny-boy @ Feb 14 2015, 23:08) *

having a rapier with END is quite nice, but it has very low PA chance and duration is the barely minimum for PA to stack. something like 25/4 or 20/5 may give you way better results.
the suffix isn't optimal, and we're speaking about 300 ADB less than what you may have (and i don't even have one butcher level). also, it would be better if you had some fatality among your potencies. with a good set of powers of slaughter you may not consider the suffix, but still...

QUOTE(Benny-boy @ Feb 14 2015, 23:08) *

It may be slow for speedranners, but with my pc/connection/slow playstyle its reasonable. I use it when they stunned, but cant say much about many SG. And its nice chance for extra heal/damage reduction. How much SP do you use for these arenas? Do you use Shadow Veil?

with SG is almost imperative a good PA chance/turn stat
also, not shadow veil if i don't use shade set.

QUOTE(Benny-boy @ Feb 14 2015, 23:08) *

P.S. Why everyone is so afraid of tsukiko tsutsukikake? IMHO its average mob.

yes, it's quite easy to kill. but you HAVE to do it at the starting of the level, before it charges its MP/SP bars - as i told you, its SP is very powerful: try to let it live for a while and please tell me what you noted (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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post Feb 15 2015, 00:23
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I have some question about the drop Limits:
Do the round Counter for Limits only Count for lower difficultier?

I mean would i get a Penalty, if i Play 1000 rounds on hell and then switch to normal?
If not:
Counts it for every difficulty sepereately or for lower difficulties together?
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post Feb 15 2015, 00:25
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QUOTE(Nottle @ Feb 14 2015, 23:23) *

I have some question about the drop Limits:
Do the round Counter for Limits only Count for lower difficultier?

I mean would i get a Penalty, if i Play 1000 rounds on hell and then switch to normal?
If not:
Counts it for every difficulty sepereately or for lower difficulties together?

You inverted: you'l get a penalty if you play 1000 consecutive rounds @Normal, hard, nightmare regardless on how you proceed.

Playing @ hell won't get you any penalty...
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