[X] My Assistant

Thanks Cats Lover, and everyone else who has mulled this question over, I am glad to see that the number of upgrades required isn't totally unrealistic (even for me). (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) I am not going to forge my current shield (hell, Defensive Matrix Modulator is worth more than the shield), I just wanted to see what might be required to get over the hump as it were, since 50% block chance seems to be the turning point for more productive 1H battling.

It looks like it gives +36.20 to me... Assuming you have maxed 1H prof and 1H Block ability slotted in, then you've got +8.2% block chance bonus from 1H Block ability alone.

Btw, I've calculated your 1H proficiency for the heck of it, is it accurate?
(36.20-31.81)/276*328=5.22+31.81=37.03
42.20-37.03=5.17*40 = about 206.8 1H proficiency.

While I'm at it, this shield have about 34% block chance pre-forging, Now it gives me 5% after 8 bindings, so how much more do I need to reach +45% (or maybe +50%) block chance?

My 1H prof is the same as my Exp level, 328. Even though the calculation was a bit off, it's interesting what you math guys can do. The last time I had to do a calculation of this nature was probably before you were born. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

While I'm at it, this shield have about 34% block chance pre-forging, Now it gives me 5% after 8 bindings, so how much more do I need to reach +45% (or maybe +50%) block chance?

assuming it was 34% on the dot, probably about 32 more forges, give or take a few, for 45%. probably give.

This post has been edited by something: May 15 2014, 09:38

exactly 40.00% block chance. nice even number. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)


forging is fucking expensive. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/mellow.gif)

the early forge is "cheaper" because you can use LG or MG mats, but it adds up pretty fast. for force shield, 1 DMM (25-30k) + B.Barrier (8-10k) + 5 mats (1k-50k) = 1 forge = ~34k-90k/forge. probably, ~35-50k/forge for the first 10 lvls (or 350k-500k for 1st 10lvls). ~50-75k/forge for the next 10 lvl (or another 500-750k for another 10lvls).

The rationale for forging is that forging a stats to PMAX is cheaper (and easier) than buying an item with base PMAX of said stats (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

Playing GF as 1H w/ Demonic Rapier and Fire Spike Shield... what infusion is better to use? Holy or Cold? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

Your rapier is L10? What strike does it has?

Yes... and well, Dark(?!)... (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/happy.gif)

No need to use holy infusion on GF. Just use elemental one.
Cold is good because you use Fire Spike Shield. (and for Arthropods! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif))

Thanks Cats Lover... (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Also, is Fire Spike really the best to use with 1H + full power slaughter?... what Spike Shield you, Colman, holy_demon and others High Level 1H use?

Thanks in advance... (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Also, is Fire Spike really the best to use with 1H + full power slaughter?... what Spike Shield you, Colman, holy_demon and others High Level 1H use?

Thanks in advance... (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I use Spike Shield based on the infusion Im using. Currently Im using Fire Spike cos I have way too many Infusions of frost.

Also, is Fire Spike really the best to use with 1H + full power slaughter?... what Spike Shield you, Colman, holy_demon and others High Level 1H use?

Thanks in advance... (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Personally I'm using Cold, but Fire and Wind also derserve consideration.
IMO it's not worth worrying about it because there's no much difference among them.

Just stick to which strike your weapon have (both by the weapon itself if elemental and by the infusion)
Fire is also good if you don't have much mitigation against fire. (eg. Dragonkins)

Also, is Fire Spike really the best to use with 1H + full power slaughter?... what Spike Shield you, Colman, holy_demon and others High Level 1H use?
Thanks in advance... (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I mostly use strom shield, because I like to use electrical infusion on weapon. they do not make big different anyway. Just use one that matching your weapon or infusion is OK.

Personally I'm using Cold, but Fire and Wind also derserve consideration.
IMO it's not worth worrying about it because there's no much difference among them.

Just stick to which strike your weapon have (both by the weapon itself if elemental and by the infusion)
Fire is also good if you don't have much mitigation against fire. (eg. Dragonkins)

If suiting your elemental strike isn't a concern, Flame is best for 1h heavy IMO since you're going to take a ton of damage and any extra mitigation is welcome. I'd only consider Frost and Storm when using light armor, but I find myself still getting hit a lot anyway so I usually end up using Flame then as well.

If suiting your elemental strike isn't a concern, Flame is best for 1h heavy IMO since you're going to take a ton of damage and any extra mitigation is welcome. I'd only consider Frost and Storm when using light armor, but I find myself still getting hit a lot anyway so I usually end up using Flame then as well.

Well... IMO "best" depends on each person's preference in this case (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Battle system functions like this (simplified) :
1. Get one's own turn
2. Check against enemy's evade/block/parry/resist/other status effect
3. Damage reduction by PMI/MMI/specific mitigation/other status effect

Cold spike affects step 1, Wind spike affects step 2, Flame spike affects step 3.
And according to the description the amount is all the same, 10%.

This is similar question like "Which one is better, PMI vs. Evade/Block/Parry(and Resist in some manner)?"
PMI and Flame spike assures less damage taken, while Evade/Block/Parry and Wind/Cold spike gives a chance to dodge even a hit.

But again, the bonus from spike shield is really small, so I don't care about it seriously. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Thanks all for your help, much appreciated. It's going to be long term solution to the Spirit loss in battle, as my Forbidden prof is almost non-existent at 1.5 and at 7% chance of processing Ripened Soul, is not something that I can reliably count on. At least I might be able to get a taste of what Spirit Theft will be like. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

the amount of MP/SP that you can drain per turn is also dependant on the amount of MP/SP the monster currently has, so remember to silence it to prevent it from using its MP/SP.

generally the drain amount will be at max if the monster has at least 50% MP/SP respectively.

But again, the bonus from spike shield is really small, so I don't care about it seriously. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

It would be nice if there were abilities that could enhance the effects of these status effect procs.

It would be nice if there were abilities that could enhance the effects of these status effect procs.

Or it would be fine if it always functions passively (without status effect), not procs by the chance.
And I want to see their exact effect on the log, as well. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

AFK for a few hours, and lots of replies.

It seems you have never try forging (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

More like I never bothered calculating it. And last i checked, I recall that the stat bonus from forging is the highest on the first few forge, drooping down as you forge it more, up to around 135% now or 140% for non-ADB/MDB stats in the past.
Speaking of the forging, I've actually forged quite a few things already, among other things that exq-ethereal staff I've brought from Brewdonkey really.

Also, I've got this:

A while ago, forging would increase your base stat by only 1%. Now forging follows a logarithmic formula; the first gives you 2.75% increase in your stat, which then diminishes to about 0.25%. This is good for non-rich players because you don't need to forge so much to get a good return. This is bad for higher level players because damage used to be doubled (now only 167%) for full forging. Even worse for mage bc we also rely on EDB, which is now only 135%, instead of 150%. But again, you don't need to fully forge to play successfully as mage.

Meh it was 140% before. So except for MDB we didn't lose that much as long as we give more mats to get to the max.

ah yes, forgot about the level of forge was increased from 40 to 50 for non-damage.

Base block of the shield = 31.81
Scaled block by the shield at your level (Lv 328) = 37.03
Your block bonus from 1H Block = 0.082 (∵0.4220 = 1 - (1 - 1H Block) * (1 - 0.3703))
Your 1H Proficiency = 328 max (∵328 * 0.025 = 8.2)

You need to get 45.53% block chance from your shield to reach 50% at current level.
(∵1 - (1 - 0.082) * (1 - 0.4553) = 0.5)

45.53 / 37.03 = 1.2295

And you can get about x1.2268 with 22 times Non-ADB forging. (∵0.195 * ln(0.1 * forging_level + 1))
So you need to upgrade the current shield at least 22~23 times to get 50% block at your level.

BTW IMO find better shield which is forgeable (mmax+) (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

@LostLogia4
Block chance is also added multiplicatively as other stats like critical chance or specific mitigation.
So if you have shield which provides 45% block chance, and get 10% from 1H Block ability, your block chance will be 50.5%, not 55%.
1 - (1 - 0.45) * (1 - 0.1) = 0.505

Uh, oh, guess I missed the calculation by a league...
But "multiplicative addition"? Pretty sure I hardly ever heard about this kind of addition before...

My 1H prof is the same as my Exp level, 328. Even though the calculation was a bit off, it's interesting what you math guys can do. The last time I had to do a calculation of this nature was probably before you were born. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Comes with the territory of games where numbers were prevalent really. Half the fun in these kinds of math was to assume multiple forms of calculations until you found the right number/formula.

I calculated it as:
(39.10-34.36)/276*328=5.22+34.36=+39.99% block chance...
is it exactly 40% from your side? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

exactly 40.00% block chance. nice even number. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Interesting, how it works, hmm... maybe I'll ask Blacksmith-kun next to confirm the formula...
Hmm, if I calculate it right it would be about (39.10-34.36)/276*500=8.58+34.36= +42.94% block chance form Dani's perspective.

assuming it was 34% on the dot, probably about 32 more forges, give or take a few, for 45%. probably give.

Hmm, the same as malkatmp's... Then again, last i checked, the forging formula is kinda wonky and stuff...

This post has been edited by LostLogia4: May 15 2014, 14:09

But "multiplicative addition"? Pretty sure I hardly ever heard about this kind of addition before...

how to put it? maybe not a very technical way to say it, but it kinda do its job (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

Add)
The factors: X1, X2, X3, ..., Xn
Total = X1 + X2 + X3 + ... + Xn
Examples: ADB (=WD), MDB, EDB, PABs, ...

Multiplicatively Add)
The factors: X1, X2, X3, ..., Xn
Total = 1 - (1 - X1) * (1 - X2) * (1 - X3) * ... * (1 - Xn)
Examples: PMI, MMI, Evade/Block/Parry/Resist, Critical chance, Specific mitigations, ...

Maybe complex? Let's consider it from a different point of view.

When you get 10% block from a gear, then you have 90% chance to be hit. (1 - 0.1 = 0.9)
If you have additional 10% block from another gear, now you have 81% chance to be hit. (0.9 * 0.9 = 0.81)
In other words, you have 19% chance to block an enemy's attack with these two gears.

1 - (1 - 0.1) * (1 - 0.1) = 0.19

The other stats which are "added multiplicatively" also calculated like this.

Add)
The factors: X1, X2, X3, ..., Xn
Total = X1 + X2 + X3 + ... + Xn
Examples: ADB (=WD), MDB, EDB, PABs, ...

Multiplicatively Add)
The factors: X1, X2, X3, ..., Xn
Total = 1 - (1 - X1) * (1 - X2) * (1 - X3) * ... * (1 - Xn)
Examples: PMI, MMI, Evade/Block/Parry/Resist, Critical chance, Specific mitigations, ...

Maybe complex? Let's consider it from a different point of view.

When you get 10% block from a gear, then you have 90% chance to be hit. (1 - 0.1 = 0.9)
If you have additional 10% block from another gear, now you have 81% chance to be hit. (0.9 * 0.9 = 0.81)
In other words, you have 19% chance to block an enemy's attack with these two gears.

1 - (1 - 0.1) * (1 - 0.1) = 0.19

The other stats which are "added multiplicatively" also calculated like this.

*keeping at math talks*
Okay, uh... how do I make this kinda calculation in spreadsheet program? I have a method in mind, but that'll need quite a coordination to get it right...

*keeping at math talks*
Okay, uh... how do I make this kinda calculation in spreadsheet program? I have a method in mind, but that'll need quite a coordination to get it right...

wouldn't it be enough to calculate hit chance in a square (starting from block chance in another square), then proceed with that? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

btw, for 1H heavy armors: better (in comparison) +150ADB (read slaughters) or +15% hit/+5% crit chance (read balance)?

This post has been edited by Scremaz: May 15 2014, 15:00

*keeping at math talks*
Okay, uh... how do I make this kinda calculation in spreadsheet program? I have a method in mind, but that'll need quite a coordination to get it right...

imo, you're just over thinking it. also, (1-0) = 1. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

wouldn't it be enough to calculate hit chance in a square (starting from block chance in another square), then proceed with that? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

btw, for 1H heavy armors: better (in comparison) +150ADB (read slaughters) or +15% hit/+5% crit chance (read balance)?

balance = better for wallet; probably, can get a Mag for <100k. ie WTS or [aoieu] https://forums.e-hentai.org/index.php?showtopic=165563
slaughter = better for killing; if you calculated the "expected damage" between those 2, balance is a bit lower. also, 15% or 50% hit means very little to 1H+heavy. though, a bit more costly & improve your clear time.

also, just nabbed this from Bazaar for ~30k. seems like an awesome deal. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

This post has been edited by malkatmp: May 15 2014, 15:26

Hmm, the same as malkatmp's... Then again, last i checked, the forging formula is kinda wonky and stuff...

well, going by the data in the forging thread, the multipliers are off by like 0.01 and the points between 19 and 30 are off (probably due to rounding), but it's pretty accurate.

case in point, using the formula the base stats that show up on mouseover for my rapier's accuracy and parry should be 47.09%(from 38.83) and 23.83%(from 18.81) respectively

This post has been edited by something: May 15 2014, 15:25