[X] My Assistant

One important thing to consider when deciding whether to get Fatality or Butcher is the amount of crit you currently have. Total Crit chance is way more important for Fatality than it is for Butcher.

Fatality adds

CODE

(Total Crit Chance/100)*(0.02*Base Attack Damage)

per potency level of average damage per hit, Butcher adds

CODE

(Weapon Damage*0.02)*(1-Total Crit Chance)+(Weapon Damage*0.02)*(Total Crit Chance*Crit Damage modifier)

of average damage per hit per potency level. You can ignore the brackets, I just put them in there to spot which calculations are "relevant" to eachother. Instead of having to rely on an assumption or opinion, it's better to calculate the average damage increase for yourself and see which one adds more damage.

If you only have low amounts of crit, butcher is still the superior choice. This rarely ever happens thanks to Heartseeker though.

This post has been edited by erwtsnert: Oct 10 2013, 23:20

just realized i have 250 hath.
I have IA3, and Crys1.

Should i get Vig Vit, or save it for crys2, respl regen, effluent ether, etc?

I'm 2h heavy main, so not immediately seeing how another 25% hp will really do anything for me. Base health is 6640 (total health is 15 to 16k depending on what i wear).

I don't GF much. Mostly just do the first couple arenas on pfudor / iwbth, and then finish off normal for tokens, and do some IWs when i have time or inclination.

If you don't have any intention of doing marathons on the higher difficulties or have trouble clearing the arena in general the combat perks are pretty much just wasted. With Vigorous Vitality you'll have ~20k Health, which means you can leave Spirit Shield off when wearing the right armor in the 2-schoolgirl rounds of the marathons, saving spirit pots you need for the 3-schoolgirl rounds. Though that's only if you can't clear DwD on IWBTH and do want to DwD runs.

I'd say Crys2 is the best option.

About Fatality / Butcher:— Noted that some physical attack (ex: counter, elem strike, bleed), despite what it said in battle log, never crit.

This post has been edited by buktore: Oct 11 2013, 18:08

One important thing to consider when deciding whether to get Fatality or Butcher is the amount of crit you currently have. Total Crit chance is way more important for Fatality than it is for Butcher.

Fatality adds

CODE

(Total Crit Chance/100)*(0.02*Base Attack Damage)

per potency level of average damage per hit, Butcher adds

CODE

(Weapon Damage*0.02)*(1-Total Crit Chance)+(Weapon Damage*0.02)*(Total Crit Chance*Crit Damage modifier)

of average damage per hit per potency level. You can ignore the brackets, I just put them in there to spot which calculations are "relevant" to eachother. Instead of having to rely on an assumption or opinion, it's better to calculate the average damage increase for yourself and see which one adds more damage.

If you only have low amounts of crit, butcher is still the superior choice. This rarely ever happens thanks to Heartseeker though.

Wouldn't butcher always be preferable, regardless of crit chance? For example, say your base damage using the weapon is currently 1000, and your critical damage multiplier is 50%. For regular attacks, 1 level of butcher would increases your base damage level to 1020, and for critical hits it would increase your damage to 1530 (150% of 1020), right?

Whereas 1 level of fatality would leave regular attacks unaffected, and increase damage for critical hits to 1520 (152% of 1000)... Or am I misunderstanding how this works?

Also, what's the likelihood of encountering a boss monster in any given IW run? Is it affected by the difficulty setting at all?

This post has been edited by habbababba31: Oct 11 2013, 00:01

Wouldn't butcher always be preferable, regardless of crit chance? For example, say your base damage using the weapon is currently 1000, and your critical damage multiplier is 50%. For regular attacks, 1 level of butcher would increases your base damage level to 1020, and for critical hits it would increase your damage to 1530 (150% of 1020), right?

Whereas 1 level of fatality would leave regular attacks unaffected, and increase damage for critical hits to 1520 (152% of 1000)... Or am I misunderstanding how this works?

You'd be right if the weapon was the only source of damage, however, STR/DEX and Power/Shade add a lot of extra ADB. Butcher only applies to the weapon whereas Fatality applies to all pieces of equipment.

@habbababba31
butcher only increases base damage of weapon. the rest of your damage factors (coming from level and your str/dex pabs and armor +adb bonuses) accounts for more of the damage than your scenario depicts. Fatality works off your total damage, and when high enough level, maybe past lvl 300s, lot of DWers have >50% crit-- +heartseeker means >60% crit. If you're critting > half the time, +2% crit damage makes more sense.

Scenario w/ my current equips:
I have estoc w/ 1761 dmg, 1 butcher. Total damage is 5723 (so 3962 damage from other factors). Crit for me is x1.52 = 8699
add a level of butcher would make weapon 1795 dmg, Total damage ~5755. Crit would = 8747.6
add a level of fatality instead, crit would be 5723*1.54 = 8813

If you don't have any intention of doing marathons on the higher difficulties or have trouble clearing the arena in general the combat perks are pretty much just wasted. With Vigorous Vitality you'll have ~20k Health, which means you can leave Spirit Shield off when wearing the right armor in the 2-schoolgirl rounds of the marathons, saving spirit pots you need for the 3-schoolgirl rounds. Though that's only if you can't clear DwD on IWBTH and do want to DwD runs.

I'd say Crys2 is the best option.

thanks

This post has been edited by etothex: Oct 11 2013, 00:29

etothex: I'd say Resplendent Regeneration, it is probably the strongest melee combat perk and crystarium won't serve you fast if you don't gf.

Fatality seems better on average if you run with slaugher or DW

i agree.

Fatality better with DW.

And it'll better if DW ppl use savage shadowdancer as well (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I think Fatality is much better for 1H users especially,
because 1H's WD has small factor of their total damage beside the other play style (except Axe user) (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

just realized i have 250 hath.
I have IA3, and Crys1.

Should i get Vig Vit, or save it for crys2, respl regen, effluent ether, etc?

I'm 2h heavy main, so not immediately seeing how another 25% hp will really do anything for me. Base health is 6640 (total health is 15 to 16k depending on what i wear).

I don't GF much. Mostly just do the first couple arenas on pfudor / iwbth, and then finish off normal for tokens, and do some IWs when i have time or inclination.

You're almost like me. I have IA3, Crys1, and 250 Hath as well.
I decided to select RR after considering VV, EE, and RR. I should collect more Hath. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I think Fatality is much better for 1H users especially,
because 1H's WD has small factor of their total damage beside the other play style (except Axe user) (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) different ppl got different though (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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btw, few hour ago i accidently go to PFUDOR IW (mace lvl 5) after 1 week not touch HV (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
then I go again IWTB IW (mace lvl 6)

I clear both of those,
but i got a lot trouble when go to IWTB IW (mace lvl 6). I feel PFUDOR IW (mace lvl 5) much easier (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

so if my mace's lvl went up, the difficulty also when up? anybody know?

This post has been edited by zanky: Oct 11 2013, 12:34

No. The difficulty only depends on the difficulty setting, the item's quality, and how many rounds you go.

No. The difficulty only depends on the difficulty setting, the item's quality, and how many rounds you go.

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) if it like that then

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) strange

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/mellow.gif) something strange happen

but thanks (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

72 isn't too bad if on IWBTH, on Hard it's too high. Did you use holy/dark infusions? That can really speed things up.

For Hard I meant that is just Hard. Difficulty was Nightmare. I cleared that arena. Not even thining on it on Hell. Maybe when I hollowforge weapon (but it won't happen anytime soon, unlike you I can't go to IW on higher diff than Nightmare).

For Hard I meant that is just Hard. Difficulty was Nightmare. I cleared that arena. Not even thining on it on Hell. Maybe when I hollowforge weapon (but it won't happen anytime soon, unlike you I can't go to IW on higher diff than Nightmare).

well the first time I clear IWTB T&T with my mace when I around 250 (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Finally i can beat arena TTT on IWTB (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)
i'm happy but it's so damn long (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/mad.gif)
need more than 1 hour i think (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)
(without depre of course,mine still 2.69)

by the way solar, you right about stat (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
Thanks for that.
this mine now,and i think it's enough (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

don't say i'm wrong again (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/mellow.gif)
i'm already sick with lot of mistake i do (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/anime_cry.gif)
but i don't mind if somebody point out my mistake (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) so i can "repair" it.(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

you can do that too, soon (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

and IW much more difficult than arena (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

This post has been edited by zanky: Oct 11 2013, 13:33

For Hard I meant that is just Hard. Difficulty was Nightmare. I cleared that arena. Not even thining on it on Hell. Maybe when I hollowforge weapon (but it won't happen anytime soon, unlike you I can't go to IW on higher diff than Nightmare).

I think you should buy a eternal weapon instead of IW a weapon to lv10.
The cost of IWing is higher than buy a better weapon in most of the case.

I think you should buy a eternal weapon instead of IW a weapon to lv10.
The cost of IWing is higher than buy a better weapon in most of the case.

Ethereal.

WTB: Etheral Mag\Leg Axe with 4PAB

@loli If i'm not wrong, it's hard to get 4 PAB now. Because new equip only drop max 3 PAB. Only old equip got more than 3 PAB.

clark also said same thing like this (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/mellow.gif)

btw, what your style now? are U still 1H? why U use axe?

This post has been edited by zanky: Oct 11 2013, 17:33

@loli If i'm not wrong, it's hard to get 4 PAB now. Because new equip only drop max 3 PAB. Only old equip got more than 3 PAB.

clark also said same thing like this (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/mellow.gif)

yeah , now all weapon only have 3 PAB (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)



my axe have 4PAB (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/duck.gif)



500 hellfest , tired + sleepy and cannot continue (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

my first cure in round 280 (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)


i think it is time to unlock crystal perk (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/wub.gif)

This post has been edited by nobody_xxx: Oct 11 2013, 17:28