[X] My Assistant

Fine then, "more" removed, my point here was that you obfuscated the question in regards to parry and veil.

Implying that 20% parry is superior when you have higher evade isn't right.

… in regards to parry …

… someone translate what he's saying.

1 - (1 - Evade) * (1 - Shadow) =
1 - (1 - Evade) * (1 - 0.2) =
0.2 + 0.8 * Evade

Shadow Veil itself is 20% in the formula, but casting Shadow Veil makes you effectively receive 16% if your Evade is 20%, and 12% if your Evade is 40%.

holy_demon was saying that what you effectively receive from Shadow Veil diminishes as your Evade gets higher, and you said he's wrong because you thought he was talking about Shadow Veil's value in the formula.

This post has been edited by aurabolt: Feb 26 2013, 08:52

@Battlecaster Arcanist above: Might as well use frugal cloth. But no, it isn't really viable past certain point that is very low level due the way EDB and prof scales, aside from low INT and WIS on equips and no staff cutting your damage by about a third - you'll lose increasing % of your damage, so you'll be doing less than half the damage you would otherwise(with mana cost not much better than a good Focus staff which sacrifices far, far less). Taking twice thrice, four,etc times the time for lesser rewards is no good.

@aurabolt: You know what you did.

I know we've been through this before, but the situation is different.

He's asking about a HYBRID build, i.e. a part-time fighter, part-time mage. For that, Arcanist Shade is indeed a viable build. You get more out of Protection now than heavy melees, while mana costs remain low enough for you to cast spells with relative abandon.

I suppose you could argue that if you want to mage more, you should switch to Cloth + Staff. But we know that TenB wants to bugger up proficiencies giving damage, so Gossamer gets tossed out the window. Which leaves Phase - and honestly, if you use Phase + Staff, that's not a hybrid build. Arcanist Shade + Staff, that's a hybrid build - and one that's not so bad, given that you get all the benefits of CM & ET, while Arcane Blow means you can do a reasonable job of the occasional melee.

I've tried going the other way (1H + Shield + Cloth), and it's awfully scary.

Misclick.

This post has been edited by aurabolt: Feb 26 2013, 08:03

Question about frenzied blows.
On an arena like trio, where do you try and time the skill, go off to start a round?
On the schoolgirl arenas, where do you try and time the skill, after killing all but bosses?
Do you only start chains from full OC or whenever it works to time out?
These are with respect to try to minimize completion time.

This post has been edited by Arxdewn: Feb 26 2013, 08:12

I'm a lower level player than you but I go in with Skills when I'm at max OC (150%) and use the next tier on the final turn of Chain I / II. For Frenzied Blows, I use it for 6+ mobs if below Nightmare or Spirit Stance first on the second last turn then FB.

I beat my Trio and the Tree Fates with a 105% + SS Frenzied Blows in the second turn. On Hard mode though.

Question about frenzied blows.
On an arena like trio, where do you try and time the skill, go off to start a round?
On the schoolgirl arenas, where do you try and time the skill, after killing all but bosses?
Do you only start chains from full OC or whenever it works to time out?
These are with respect to try to minimize completion time.

I just use frenzied blows to schoolgirls only except when round 90 above ...

Still consume time alot thanks to WINDOWS 8 (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cry.gif)

obfuscated

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Question about frenzied blows.
1. On an arena like trio, where do you try and time the skill, go off to start a round?
2. On the schoolgirl arenas, where do you try and time the skill, after killing all but bosses?
3. Do you only start chains from full OC or whenever it works to time out?
These are with respect to try to minimize completion time.

1. Don't use for trio and below, spirit stance is faster (except for final rounds maybe)
2. After killing everything else, usually the buildup can procs PA * 3 before the skill, test what works best for you
3. Full/near full OC on battletoads and iwbth i would say, though I didn't play them below battletoads. Konata doesn't need nearly as much.

This post has been edited by fishinsea: Feb 26 2013, 08:55

My full OC FB does about as much damage as the three stronger girls have hp, not counting build up or chain skills. Would you start chaining on monsters before? That kind of makes it tricky to get the stacks of PA up if things dont cooperate. Konata rounds really throw off the rhythm I've found as she loses most of her hp from a SS backstab let alone FB.

As for trio and earlier arena, I did mean for later rounds, FB on 4 mobs is pretty high overkill. It can one shot 8+ mobs though with good rolls.

This post has been edited by Arxdewn: Feb 26 2013, 09:03

@xmagus: An interesting thought now indeed, but I maintain that it gets rapidly worse with increasing level - sacrificing 200% EDB is untenable when in the end you have relatively similar mana costs, but sacrificing 60% EDB in exchange for being able to be safely cast tier 1 spells should break even in efficiency. I think staff needs better skills.

I don't use frenzied for regular mobs, only schoolgirls/FSM/Trio/Dragons. For regular mobs just use spirit stance and attack (it's far more efficient). For schoolgirls, you want to max out your OC by attacking the normal mobs. After they are defeated, start your skills on the schoolgirl(s). Make sure you build up as much OC for frenzied blows as possible though, to do this don't activate spirit stance until right before frenzied blows (this is the most efficient way to use your OC damage wise as the majority of your damage will come from frenzied blows, trust me, I've tried many methods extensively and this is the best one).

0. Cast "slow" on the schoolgirl (this is optional but you can get your OC much higher with it)
1. First, make sure you have 3x PA active with max turns left on it, preferably 6 or 7 if you have a good rapier.
2. Then, use iris strike, then do your normal attacks to build up OC (the max before chain 2 runs out).
3. Use backstab on the last turn, then do your normal attacks to build OC
4. When there's 1 turn left activate spirit stance
5. 0 turns left use frenzied blows.

This is the best way to fight any schoolgirl one-on-one (this actually takes a lot of micro-managing but I am use to doing it quickly and turn wise it is the fastest way).

With 2 or more schoolgirls it gets a bit more complex. Before the last 2 patches it was so easy too (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cry.gif) (you just activated PA on each schoolgirl and then did the skills on one of them). Now, it's a must that you cast "slow" on them. Get each proc'ed with 2x or 3x PA. Then execute the skills on one of them. This will take some feeling out until you get your rhythm with how many PA stacks you can do and how much OC you can build. This often gets time consuming if you try to do everything perfect. I suggest you just get a pattern going and stick with it (even if it is just concentrating on one girl). Also if there's not a lot of life left on them, sometimes it's easiest just to finish them off with spirit stance.

This post has been edited by T_Starrk: Feb 26 2013, 10:03

I get significant overkill doing that on BT on a single schoolgirl, Konata even dies in like 5 hits max, especially since chaining was desynced from turns. Often I can reach 270+ OC for FB. Would bumping it up to IWBTH be more efficient or just live with it?

Also, what's the purpose of the slow?

This post has been edited by Arxdewn: Feb 26 2013, 11:29

For a newbie at lvl<100 using shade armor, club/rapier, what kind of stats should I be aiming for?

Int and Wis Below current level, everything else at or close to?

This post has been edited by Torabo: Feb 26 2013, 12:52

For a newbie at lvl<100 using shade armor, club/rapier, what kind of stats should I be aiming for?

Int and Wis Below current level, everything else at or close to?

WIS at or around your level, actually. Pump up END and STR; a DW needs as much as possible from attack and HP. DEX also, for crit rate.

I suppose AGI should come next, for Evade, but otherwise DEX gives much better stats.

Since maging is the new black, phase is cheaper than power, I have a decent katalox and I'm only doing runs in heroic anyway, I'm going to shop for a set of sup/exq fenrir phases.

Is there any stat I should pay attention to, besides EDB?

For a newbie at lvl<100 using shade armor, club/rapier, what kind of stats should I be aiming for?

Int and Wis Below current level, everything else at or close to?

WIS at or around your level, actually. Pump up END and STR; a DW needs as much as possible from attack and HP. DEX also, for crit rate.

I suppose AGI should come next, for Evade, but otherwise DEX gives much better stats.

AFAIK below lvl 100 you don't have enough xp to have more than 4 stats equal to your level. Anyway STR and END should be your priorities, followed by AGI/DEX, then WIS and lastly INT.
About AGI/DEX, it seems that those stats will evolve, but since we don't know how... It's kinda hard to tell what is the best plan.

Don't worry too much for now, you still gain levels quickly and you should be able to balance your stats just by leveling if you notice something is off with your playstyle. Of course you can also reallocate some stats.

Personnally I found the easiest way to balance my stats is by keeping their cost ratio rather than lvl ratio (except for INT that I keep at 0.8x lvl). Hope that helps (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Since maging is the new black, phase is cheaper than power, I have a decent katalox and I'm only doing runs in heroic anyway, I'm going to shop for a set of sup/exq fenrir phases.

Is there any stat I should pay attention to, besides EDB?

INT, WIS, and Evade. If you want, AGI and/or DEX too.

Maging is the new black only until the next patch or so. The magic aspects of the PMI/MMI revamp, which could include changes to mage gear (e.g., making gossamer more desirable) and other things, haven't been implemented yet, so I would recommend holding off on breaking the bank on mage gear, unless you're gunning for bottom-of-the-barrel phase. When that patch hits, for all we know, mages might be nerfed into oblivion, or have to reconfigure their equipment or something.

INT, WIS, and Evade. If you want, AGI and/or DEX too.

Maging is the new black only until the next patch or so. The magic aspects of the PMI/MMI revamp, which could include changes to mage gear (e.g., making gossamer more desirable) and other things, haven't been implemented yet, so I would recommend holding off on breaking the bank on mage gear, unless you're gunning for bottom-of-the-barrel phase. When that patch hits, for all we know, mages might be nerfed into oblivion, or have to reconfigure their equipment or something.

I just bought this [Superior Phase Cap of Fenrir] with max wiki edb for a pretty low price. Is it bottom-of-the-barrel, cream-of-the-top, or somewhere in between?

I get significant overkill doing that on BT on a single schoolgirl, Konata even dies in like 5 hits max, especially since chaining was desynced from turns. Often I can reach 270+ OC for FB. Would bumping it up to IWBTH be more efficient or just live with it?

Also, what's the purpose of the slow?

Slow is to make sure PA doesn't annoyingly expire right before you frenzy. And why don't you try IWBTH to see if it's worth your time?

Slow is to make sure PA doesn't annoyingly expire right before you frenzy. And why don't you try IWBTH to see if it's worth your time?

Isn't that what 7-turn rapiers are for?