[X] My Assistant

What's the problem in leveling up too fast later on? Plus, it's not a problem now since I don't think I'll hit even level 60 any time soon.

The idea is that you need to take the time to build up your proficiencies before you level too fast. Higher proficiencies make you stronger in the long run, but you probably wouldn't notice that unless they already were high. It can cut down on how much burden you carry, which increases your action speed. Donating would mean an automatic EXP boost that you can't turn off, so levelling too fast could actually hurt you in that case, as you don't have time enough to raise your proficiencies at a decent speed. For example, some people like to keep their proficiencies as close to their level as possible.

Its really mostly an issue with magic. Armor and weapon, with the exception of Shield, proficiency raise very easily since they're passive. Sure, you're going to take a bigger hit at the beginning if you're wearing heavy burden/high interference armor, but it becomes more manageable. But magic, it takes active casting and you only have so much MP (especially if you're low WIS) even if you're casting the cheapest spells of the class. Add in the fact that some magic classes aren't even open to you until higher levels, and you're gonna get behind (though the ones that matter most to general survivability, Support and Curative, were moved earlier a long time ago).

In other news, got a response from Tenboro regarding the whole Barriers vs Elemental Damage issue, if anyone's still interested. The Final Word from The Law:

Only spells, not elemental physical attacks.

Which means Barrier Rating and the Barrier spell are really only useful against half of the elemental damage mobs -- just the guys who cast skills.

This post has been edited by cmal: Nov 17 2009, 19:30

At the moment, I have only 1 AP in Weaken, simply so I can have a spammable deprecating spell which won't kill my target. Should I be pumping the other 4 AP into it now, or not really worry about it until later? What exactly do those extra AP do anyway?

At the moment, I have only 1 AP in Weaken, simply so I can have a spammable deprecating spell which won't kill my target. Should I be pumping the other 4 AP into it now, or not really worry about it until later? What exactly do those extra AP do anyway?

For most (or possibly all) spells that can use more than one AP, additional points increase either damage, duration, and/or overall effectiveness. For example, for a long time I only had one AP in Poison, and on average it did maybe 45 damage per turn. Now I've filled it up, and at last check, I think it was doing somewhere around 140 damage (the number of turns it lasts also increased), and I imagine that damage might go up with more proficiency.

In other words, in most cases, if you plan to use a spell at all or a lot, you should fill it up with AP for best results. For Weaken, I know more points increases how long it lasts, and probably makes it more effective overall.

I'm realizing that my stats are lagging a decent bit behind my level at the moment. Maybe I'm putting points into too many different stats? I'm lvl 46, and I've got:
STR: 45
DEX: 42
AGI: 42
END: 45
INT: 31
WIS: 42

I was originally putting 1 point into each stat except INT each level, but I'm realizing that isn't sustainable at this level.

Since I'm going for a mid-low compromise DW build (2 cloth, 2 plate, 1 leather; 57 interference, 66 burden) which stats should I start focusing more on? How far behind my level should I let the others slide?

I'm realizing that my stats are lagging a decent bit behind my level at the moment. Maybe I'm putting points into too many different stats? I'm lvl 46, and I've got:
STR: 45
DEX: 42
AGI: 42
END: 45
INT: 31
WIS: 42

I was originally putting 1 point into each stat except INT each level, but I'm realizing that isn't sustainable at this level.

Since I'm going for a mid-low compromise DW build (2 cloth, 2 plate, 1 leather; 57 interference, 66 burden) which stats should I start focusing more on? How far behind my level should I let the others slide?

You can let your INT down to about -10 (you can let it slide further as you level higher and if you don't use hostile spells that much) and your WIS to about -5 and get it back up to snuff later. If you're doing DW, then you need to keep AGI as close to your level as possible, then DEX. END should always be at your level since that's literally your lifeblood. STR you can let slide a couple of points, but try to keep it a point or three behind.

I'm realizing that my stats are lagging a decent bit behind my level at the moment. Maybe I'm putting points into too many different stats? I'm lvl 46, and I've got:
STR: 45
DEX: 42
AGI: 42
END: 45
INT: 31
WIS: 42

I was originally putting 1 point into each stat except INT each level, but I'm realizing that isn't sustainable at this level.

Since I'm going for a mid-low compromise DW build (2 cloth, 2 plate, 1 leather; 57 interference, 66 burden) which stats should I start focusing more on? How far behind my level should I let the others slide?

I think it was cmal that suggested keeping STR and END slightly ahead of the others (I think mine are 5-7 ahead now), personally I consider those the most important no matter what style you use. But the others still matter, because they factor into important things like the strength of your physical and magic defenses, evasion rate, and how often your offhand comes into play. By the way, have you seen the HV Tips thread. I think it would answer many of your questions.

I think it was cmal that suggested keeping STR and END slightly ahead of the others (I think mine are 5-7 ahead now), personally I consider those the most important no matter what style you use. But the others still matter, because they factor into important things like the strength of your physical and magic defenses, evasion rate, and how often your offhand comes into play. By the way, have you seen the HV Tips thread. I think it would answer many of your questions.

For now, I think he can let STR slip a tiny bit, but as soon as he gets surplus points, he should get it up to equal. END is always critical, however. And at a lower level, I think getting any increase in offhand proc chance would be beneficial for damage output, so I suggested AGI be his next priority.

Thanks for the advice guys. Looks like I'll be pumping my next several thousand EXP into AGI to bring it up to snuff, then focusing on END/AGI with DEX/STR secondary and INT/WIS tertiary.

I would really like some advice if possible...

I'm loosing at the arenas way too much.
(IMG:[i48.tinypic.com] http://i48.tinypic.com/1z4h7x0.jpg)

Equipment:

Fighting Style: One-Handed

Mainhand Damage Type: Piercing

Offhand Damage Type: N/A

Physical Attack:
+21.6 % damage
+27.9 % hit chance
+0 % crit chance

Magical Attack:
+4.5 % damage
+0 % hit chance
+0 % crit chance

Physical Defense:
24 points absorbed
11.5 % mitigation

Magical Defense:
21.6 points absorbed
14 % mitigation

Avoidance:
+4.7 % evade
+23.7 % block
+15.8 % parry
+3 % resist

Compromise
81.8 interference
84.3 burden

Damage Mitigations
Soul Damage: 0%
Physical Damage: 0%
Crushing Damage: 16.8 %
Slashing Damage: 23.8 %
Piercing Damage: 12.8 %
Fire Damage: 21.3 % mitigation
Cold Damage: 14.6 % mitigation
Elec Damage: 20.3 % mitigation
Wind Damage: 0 % mitigation
Holy Damage: 0 % mitigation
Dark Damage: 0 % mitigation

Primary Attributes
+6.1 Strength
+0 Dexterity
+0.5 Agility
+7.4 Endurance
+0 Intelligence
+0 Wisdom

Weapon Procs
Penetrated Armor
11 % chance on hit
Lasts for 3 turns

Fighting Style Procs
Overwhelming Strikes
10 % chance on hit


Spell Proficiency
-15.74 Elemental
-2.4 Divine
+0 Forbidden
-19.11 Deprecating
-28.6 Supportive
-36.36 Curative


Spell Damage Bonus
+0% Fire damage
+0% Cold damage
+0% Elec damage
+0% Wind damage
+0% Holy damage
+0% Dark damage
+0% Soul damage

Equips:
[hv.e-hentai.org] Superior Platinum Rapier of the Nimble
[hv.e-hentai.org] Fine Platinum Tower Shield of Warding
[hv.e-hentai.org] Fine Platinum Plate Helmet of the Fire-eater
[hv.e-hentai.org] Fine Platinum Plate Cuirass
[hv.e-hentai.org] Average Platinum Plate Gauntlets of the Frost-born
[hv.e-hentai.org] Fair Platinum Chainmail Chausses of the Thunder-child
[hv.e-hentai.org] Exquisite Titanium Plate Sabatons

I would really like some advice if possible...

I would recommend these things:

1) Put 5 points into Weaken. At my level, 5-pt weaken reduces the physical damage dealt by the target by almost 2/3, and it lasts for a long time. It makes mini-bosses and strong normal monsters (tentacle monsters, peacocks, etc) hit like little pussies.

2) Switch out some of that heavy plate with Silk. Your magic (cures, shields, weakens, Shadow Veil if you decide to get it) is severely hindered by your high interference. Silk is great because it gives 0 interference and low burden, as well as direct +hit to your melee attacks. The reduced burden also speeds up your actions, meaning monsters get less "double attacks" against you due to them being faster than you.

3) You may want to give Dual Wielding a try. With a high accuracy/high parry offhand, you get similar protection as wearing a shield, but with reduced burden/interference and vastly higher damage output (due to offhand strikes and higher accuracy). Higher damage means faster kills and less damage taken. When I switched from heavy tank (like you) to swift, fast-attacking dual-wielder I found myself getting farther in grindfests and clearing higher arenas more easily. Even before my proficiency got out of the gutter.

4) Get to lvl 90 asap. X-attack is a huge boon to a meleer, as it effectively reduces your incoming damage by 25%. 25% faster attack means monsters get to take their turns less often per attack that you make. A good way to level faster is to find a high level Flimsy item and run through it on Heroic or higher. The monsters have high HP and give high EXP, but because it's a Flimsy item, they hit weaker than cakefest mobs. You can mow through them and gain very fast exp/hour. Just be sure to flee the IW before finishing, so that you can re-enter it without waiting 24 hours.

I would really like some advice if possible...

Physical Defense:
24 points absorbed
11.5 % mitigation

Compromise
81.8 interference
84.3 burden

Equips:
[hv.e-hentai.org] Superior Platinum Rapier of the Nimble
[hv.e-hentai.org] Fine Platinum Tower Shield of Warding
[hv.e-hentai.org] Fine Platinum Plate Helmet of the Fire-eater
[hv.e-hentai.org] Fine Platinum Plate Cuirass
[hv.e-hentai.org] Average Platinum Plate Gauntlets of the Frost-born
[hv.e-hentai.org] Fair Platinum Chainmail Chausses of the Thunder-child
[hv.e-hentai.org] Exquisite Titanium Plate Sabatons

get rid of all that elemental resist gear you have its just wasting itemization points, your burden and interference are way way way too high for the amount of mitigation/absorption you are getting, with 80 interference you should be at like 35+ absorb and 14+ mitigation... your just paying way too much in the way on compromise for the stats your getting, either swap out some of your plate for some chainmail, or hell even cloth/leather that has decent evade and mitigation.
You should probably pick up weaken and bewilder, it's helpful for multiple miniboss fights.
Other then that you might want to pick up another pack rat if your running out of mana, and maybe consider dual wield the offhand parry bonus almost makes up for the loss of block add that with the extra dmg and its overall better. But if you want to stick with shield thats fine too, but overall the scaling for DW at higher levels is better then with a shield.
Oh and if you need to drop something to get weaken/bewilder I'd drop overcharge boosts since the improvement in dmg is very marginal.

I would really like some advice if possible...

I can't give you advice on what kind of build or fighting style to use, but I will say one thing. Your equipment looks to me like it's all from random drops, judging by its level. Once you've decided on a build, you really need to spend some credits on good quality high level gear. If you don't have credits to spare... please ignore this post.

Those of you Veterans who fight as Heavy Tanks, but who have replaced one or more pieces of Plate/Chain with some other type of Armor...which specific piece(s) did you replace, and why??

If you chose to replace, say, your Plate/Chain Helm over the Plate/Chain Legs, or made any other such decision to choose one body-part over another for a Light/Cloth replacement, what was the main reason you did so? Intrteference? Burden? Magical Mitigation? Evade or Resist??


Did it end up working well for you in the long run, or did you eventually abandon such a strategy??

(P.S. Your answers may inspire me to buy one or more of your better, "other than Heavy Armor" pieces from your respective WTS Threads -since Interference and Burden won't be a problem -depending on the information you give.)


This post has been edited by Thanos008: Nov 23 2009, 03:37

I'm not really a veteran, but I have experience doing what you describe. I was originally a plate tank build, and have since switched to plate chest, leather boots, and cloth gloves, pants, helm. I replaced those particular pieces because of what types of cloth the true vets were selling. I also read advice that the chest gives the most stats, so sticking with a plate chest gets you the most benefit for the least cost.

I switched out the other pieces for the vastly reduced burden and interference, making my spells significantly more potent and my attacks a lot faster. I get almost no double-hits from monsters any more, while I was regularly seeing at least one of a mob double-hit me every round, if not 2 or more. My cures are stronger, my shields are more powerful with longer effect, and my weakens *really* gimp their target now. I also get a decent chunk of +accuracy for my melee, DEX/AGI for DW procs, and evade/resist, all from the silk I'm wearing.

I'm not really a veteran, but I have experience doing what you describe. I was originally a plate tank build, and have since switched to plate chest, leather boots, and cloth gloves, pants, helm. I replaced those particular pieces because of what types of cloth the true vets were selling. I also read advice that the chest gives the most stats, so sticking with a plate chest gets you the most benefit for the least cost.

I switched out the other pieces for the vastly reduced burden and interference, making my spells significantly more potent and my attacks a lot faster. I get almost no double-hits from monsters any more, while I was regularly seeing at least one of a mob double-hit me every round, if not 2 or more. My cures are stronger, my shields are more powerful with longer effect, and my weakens *really* gimp their target now. I also get a decent chunk of +accuracy for my melee, DEX/AGI for DW procs, and evade/resist, all from the silk I'm wearing.

But....but Sir!!

Your buttocks are showing underneath that Plate Body, with all that Cloth!!


Doesn't it hurt you something awful when the Monsters spank your non-Plate Armor behind?!?

The point of switching to mixed armor for DW is that you get evade. You're faster, so you get hit less often. Its just that it hurts like a mofo when you DO get hit. Keywords here being that its a DW setup -- YMMV if you're a 1HS.

At level 100, it seems a little odd to be asking for advice, but even though what I am doing seems to work, it is always nice to get some advice because maybe I could be doing it better.

Here is the stuff someone might need to know (abbreviated to remove useless info like magic damage +%):

[s715.photobucket.com] (IMG:[i715.photobucket.com] http://i715.photobucket.com/albums/ww154/reclaimer456/th_Character.jpg)

[s715.photobucket.com] (IMG:[i715.photobucket.com] http://i715.photobucket.com/albums/ww154/reclaimer456/th_Abilities.jpg)

[s715.photobucket.com] (IMG:[i715.photobucket.com] http://i715.photobucket.com/albums/ww154/reclaimer456/th_Abilities2.jpg)

[s715.photobucket.com] (IMG:[i715.photobucket.com] http://i715.photobucket.com/albums/ww154/reclaimer456/th_Auras.jpg)

[s715.photobucket.com] (IMG:[i715.photobucket.com] http://i715.photobucket.com/albums/ww154/reclaimer456/th_Training.jpg)

Equipment:
[hv.e-hentai.org] Fine titanium estoc of slaughter
[hv.e-hentai.org] Fair gossamer cap of the owl
[hv.e-hentai.org] Superior mithril-trimmed silk robe of the Fleet
[hv.e-hentai.org] Average silk gloves of protection
[hv.e-hentai.org] Superior mithril-trimmed silk pants of the Fleet
[hv.e-hentai.org] Average gossamer shoes of the owl

Fighting style
Two-handed
Mainhand damage type
Piercing

Physical attack
+53 % damage
+21.1 % hit chance
+3.8 % crit chance

Physical defense
19.7 points absorbed
6 % mitigation

Magical defense
15.9 points absorbed
4.3 % mitigation

Avoidance
+26.2 % evade
+0 % block
+4.6 % parry
+8.5 % resist

Compromise
8.9 interference
39.4 burden

I have no mitigations. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

Weapon procs
Penetrated armor
23 % chance on hit
Lasts for 4 turns

Fighting style procs
Domino strike
48.1 % chance on hit

I have no proficiency decreases (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

As can be seen from my build, I run an all cloth two-handed approach.

-I've considered switching over to dual-wield. (I did it before, but I find 2-handing things to be much faster thus less tedious)
-I've also considered adding a piece of leather or two since I can probably have a few without putting my interference over 25.
-I've considered switching to full leather.
-I've considered picking up poison to use against legendaries (the actual ones. I've beaten the bosses in RoB).

So, um, yeah. Feel free to suggest anything.

This post has been edited by Boggyb: Nov 23 2009, 22:18

If you can find some high-evade Light armor, that wouldn't be a bad idea. Going all leather, though, is, since consensus seems to be that its crap -- its between cloth and heavy, but not spectacular because its middle ground.

Poison could be good if you've got points to spare since you're swinging an estoc and you can proc PA. Shame there's no AoE poison.

If you do switch to DW, you'll probably do about the same DPS, just more focused instead of being able to sometimes hit extra mobs for some damage. 2H is really at its best with Bleed, because a massive Bleed sword can really mow down mobs. It'll be more tedious fighting large groups, but it'll be much easier to dispatch stragglers or fighting Bosses with DW. That'll be the trade-off between switching styles.


In other news, I'm a point away from maxing Shadow Veil, so once I've tested it out, I'll let you guys know if its worth it for making yourselves less hittable, especially those of you with massive evade as it is.

@Boggyb: The major difference I've found with DW over 2H is the huge potential for increased hit chance. With my 4-turn PA Rapier mainhand and 43.7% +hit offhand, my effective hit chance is over 85%. Your effective hit chance is 69.6%, meaning that you're twice as likely to miss your attacks. Nevermind, I'm out of date.

But....but Sir!!

Your buttocks are showing underneath that Plate Body, with all that Cloth!!
Doesn't it hurt you something awful when the Monsters spank your non-Plate Armor behind?!?

Well I've never actually done the math on it before, but lets see. I still have all my heavy tank gear (all of which I bought from vets, so it's still higher level than me).

Here's my Character page. Ever since switching to DW, I've been focusing more on AGI/END, with a secondary focus on DEX/STR. I really need to cut down on the WIS investments, I think. My primary stats seem lower relative to what most other people report for their level. Looking at Boggy's character page boggles my mind. How do you get all those stats so damn high relative to your level?


Here's my Dual-Wield layout:
[hv.e-hentai.org] Smexy Rapier
[hv.e-hentai.org] Offhand dagger of HitYouALot
[hv.e-hentai.org] Silky Smooth Cap
[hv.e-hentai.org] Full Metal Jacket
[hv.e-hentai.org] Supple Gloves
[hv.e-hentai.org] Kitty Pants
[hv.e-hentai.org] Pricey-looking Boots

That setup gives me these stats:

5.2% Crushing Mitigation
6.4% Slashing Mitigation
3.9% Piercing Mitigation

+1.6 STR
+5.6 DEX
+4.5 AGI
+1.2 END
+0 INT
+0 WIS

23.7% Offhand Strike chance

-3.70 Deprecating
-3.36 Supportive
-3.82 Curative
(That's about -9% from my base profs)
Shields last 19 turns for 13.3 points of absorption. 1-pt Shadow Veil lasts for 12 turns for 8.4% evasion. 1-pt Poison+PA ticks for 50 for 9 turns. 5-pt Weaken lasts 14 turns. I'd mention Cures, but they seem to be extremely random for some reason. Sometimes I'll heal for 220 one time, and then 184 the next.

My interference reduces my spell damage dealt by 35.8%, and causes my offensive spells to fail 15.8% of the time.
My burden increases my time units per action to 300 - 117 + (49.6 - 20) = 212.6.

With my heavy tank (1H+S) loadout, it looks more like this:
[hv.e-hentai.org] Smexy Rapier
[hv.e-hentai.org] Sir Blocksalot
[hv.e-hentai.org] Helm of Hairpulling
[hv.e-hentai.org] Full Metal Jacket
[hv.e-hentai.org] Hefty Gloves
[hv.e-hentai.org] Heavy Metal Leggings
[hv.e-hentai.org] Clunkers

With that gear on, I get these stats:

14.7% Crushing Mitigation
21.3% Slashing Mitigation
14.0% Piercing Mitigation

+4.7 STR
+1.9 DEX
+0 AGI
+4.1 END
+0 INT
+0 WIS

7.4% Overwhelming Strikes chance

-22.60 Deprecating
-20.53 Supportive
-23.35 Curative
(That's about -56% from my base profs)
Shields last 17 turns for 8.1 points of absorption. 1-pt Shadow Veil lasts for 10 turns for 6.7% evasion. When interference doesn't screw my offensive spells, 1-pt Poison+PA ticks for 39 for 7 turns, and 5-pt Weaken lasts 11 turns.

My interference reduces my spell damage dealt by 95.1%, and causes my offensive spells to fail 75% of the time.
My burden increases my time units per action to 300 - 117 + (85.9 - 20) = 248.9. That's 17% slower than my DW setup.

So the differences between my DW loadout and my heavy tank loadout are:
+5.4% damage
+36.8% hit chance (real hit chance difference is +15.25%. Tank has ~70.48% effective hit chance, DW has 85.73%)
+4.8% crit

-6.8 Physical Absorb
-4.1% Physical Mitigation
-5.4 Magic Absorb
-4.9% Magical Mitigation

+10.1% evade
-23.3% block
+9.2% parry
+3.5% resist

-59.7 Interference
-36.3 Burden

-9.5% Crushing Mitigation
-14.9% Slashing Mitigation
-10.1% Piercing Mitigation

-3.1 STR
+3.7 DEX
+4.5 AGI
-2.9 END
+0 INT
+0 WIS

So yes, attacks will hit me significantly harder when they land. However, I hit significantly harder and faster, meaning monsters die faster and deal me less total damage. My supportive and offensive spells are significantly more powerful, also helping me to stay alive longer and deal more damage.

As far as ability to complete arenas goes, I've found that I'm slightly better at clearing everything up until Blazing Field, mostly because monsters die a lot faster. The final rounds with minibosses are little bit dicier with my increased damage taken, but I just use Weaken to counteract that.

I've beaten BF one time each with heavy tank and DW, but I've failed 2 times each with both as well (4000 credits down the drain >_<).

I've only done ManBearPig in RoB so far. I stuck with my DW setup, except that I switched in my shield. That gives me a huge amount of increased avoidance against the truly dangerous boss specials (since you can't parry magic attacks, but you can block them). I have 3 more Token of Blood, so I'm hoping to clear out each of the other tier-1 bosses in short order.

This post has been edited by coredumperror: Nov 24 2009, 03:30