[X] My Assistant

Spike Shields... which one to chose?

I've tried all 4, and the one that i think is less useful is the shock one, cause don't give any status to the enemy useful to me since i use 2H\L and i'm not using magic for attack; about other 3 i can't rly chose one cause i know effects but i don't know the "how much %" are they rly effective...

Which one is better? or maybe which one is better for which situation (like number of enemies)?

For warriors, fire is best in defense. Attack depends on what weapon status you are using.

Has Chip already figured out how many MBP Tails it takes on average to get a Peerless? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Same number as any other trophy

Spike Shields... which one to chose?

I've tried all 4, and the one that i think is less useful is the shock one, cause don't give any status to the enemy useful to me since i use 2H\L and i'm not using magic for attack; about other 3 i can't rly chose one cause i know effects but i don't know the "how much %" are they rly effective...

Which one is better? or maybe which one is better for which situation (like number of enemies)?

Deep Burns (Evade and Resist reduction: 10%) is more for mages, yeah.

Searing Skin (Damage reduction: 10%), Freezing Limbs (Speed reduction: 10%) and Turbulent Air (Miss chance increase: 10%) should all decrease the damage received by 10% on average... or so it seems. Actually, if your action speed is increased (ie you are using light armor), Freezing Limbs would slow down monsters for more than 10% relatively to your speed. So, if you are using light armor, I would definitely go for the Frost Spikes. If you are using heavy armor, I'm not too sure, but Flame Spikes seems like a solid choice (more than Wind Spikes I would say) since you are expecting monsters to hit you most of the times. It has the slight-littlish advantage to give some resistances to the fire full-MP-bar attack some dragons may have, compared to other shields. Freezing Limbs is still a valid option.

Edit: All 3 reduces damage by 10% on average, actually. Flame Spikes is the "safe" option. Wind Spikes is the "feeling lucky" option. Frost Spikes is an odd case. It is always beneficial whether monsters hit or miss or are stunned, but the battle needs to be long enough for the effect to matter, so it seems to be more beneficial to mace users. It should help more if you have bonus Action Speed so you have more chances of getting time to heal between turns.

This post has been edited by Dan31: Jan 14 2014, 14:38

I'm using also Haste often, so i thnk freeze is the best choice, tnx again

Can i find somewhere the formula for the chance of Domino strike on hit? or at least are known which parameters generally influence that value?

I'm using also Haste often, so i thnk freeze is the best choice, tnx again

Can i find somewhere the formula for the chance of Domino strike on hit? or at least are known which parameters generally influence that value?

Oh, yeah, I forgot about Haste too.

Regarding the formula for domino strikes, it's in the wiki.

Two-Handed

Two-Handed weapons have a chance to proc Domino Strikes on hit, which will cause splash damage to nearby enemies. When Domino Strikes procs, it will hit at least one adjacent or one off enemy, and up to two enemies in either direction (a total number of 4 enemies splashed). Splash damage does not skip over dead enemies or wraps around. Splash damage targets have an unreduced chance to be affected by standard weapon procs like Bleeding Wounds.

Domino Strike can reach up to 3 monsters away from the primary target at 100 proficiency (6 enemies splashed at maximum). Getting domino strike to proc on the second monster will automatically proc domino strike on the third monster.
The damage of Domino Strike starts at 75%/60%/40%, increasing by one percentage point for every 10 points of proficiency, capping at 250 proficiency at 100%/85%/65%.
Domino Strikes are not guaranteed hits, they can still miss. However, the next enemy in the line can still proc domino strike even if the target enemy miss. (unless it's the primary target, in which case no domino strike will proc)
Domino Strikes can go around an adjacent dead monster if the player rolls a hit on a one off monster.
Proc chance, in order of importance, is calculated from Two-Handed Proficiency, Strength, and Dexterity. It can be calculated with the following formula:

Domino Strike Chance = 40 + (STR + DEX) * 0.02 + 2H / 10

Weapon drain effects (Vampire, Banshee, Illithid) and elemental strike effects can only proc on the primary target.
Proc chance is capped at 90%.

Oh, and I've been thinking a bit more about spike shields, see my previous post.

This post has been edited by Dan31: Jan 14 2014, 14:40

Regarding the wind spikes, it can be arguably superior to the other 3, as it can potentially save more SP against strong skills. On the other hand, it is unknown how it interacts with accuracy chaos token upgrade, fire skills are most common and not all skills hit for more than 100% your HP, so fire spike shield is pretty useful. Some actual practice test, maybe through IW? should help you settle the case.

This post has been edited by Lement: Jan 14 2014, 19:38

Regarding the wind spikes, it can be arguably superior to the other 3, as it can potentially save more SP against strong skills. On the other hand, it is unknown how it interacts with accuracy chaos token upgrade, fire skills are most common and not all skills hit for more than 100% your HP, so fire spike shield is pretty useful. Some actual practice test, maybe through IW? should help you settle the case.

The problem is "potentially", ie 10% chance. Also, with Flame Spikes, you still save SP.

I will do some math regarding SP saved with both, hold on...

Eww, the wiki is awfully unclear about the % of SP used when spirit shield triggers.

This post has been edited by Dan31: Jan 14 2014, 22:06

Leaving aside the fact that it's a different element and assuming that all monster have 100% hit chance; fire spike is clearly superior than wind— both in theory* and in practice.





** I.E. using math. No, I'm not kidding! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Huh, I've been using Shock spike this whole time.
"Deep Burns Internal damage causes slower reactions and lowers evade and resist chance. Fire resistance is lowered."

You mean it's only been a 10% dodge reduction this whole time?

About Deep Burns effect; this post is both informative and hilarious. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Leaving aside the fact that it's a different element and assuming that all monster have 100% hit chance; fire spike is clearly superior than wind— both in theory* and in practice.
** I.E. using math. No, I'm not kidding! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Hey, don't just say something is true just by saying "I did the math and tested it". Show us at least the math part or a clear explanation of why it is superior.

But yeah, Flame Spikes is better because it has no variations. 10% damage reduction, no compromise. It helps you dealing with the worst case scenario. But with Wind Spikes, you will regularly and randomly have cases when monsters never miss for several turns and suffer more. Regen prefers stability over variation too.

BTW, we didn't talk about the resistance reduction of spikes, but Freezing Limbs lowers wind resistance, which is a popular element because giants (AKA the tanky chunks of meat) and dragons (good END too) are weak against it. Frost Shield FTW.

Huh, I've been using Shock spike this whole time.
"Deep Burns Internal damage causes slower reactions and lowers evade and resist chance. Fire resistance is lowered."

You mean it's only been a 10% dodge reduction this whole time?

(IMG:[garfie.g.a.pic.centerblog.net] http://garfie.g.a.pic.centerblog.net/2a23f380.jpg)

This post has been edited by Dan31: Jan 14 2014, 23:08

You know what, screw it, I'm taking out spike APs and putting them into support abilities for the time being.

You know what, screw it, I'm taking out spike APs and putting them into support abilities for the time being.

Nay, you shouldn't do that. Spikes aren't much, but are still something. You probably have all the support abilities you really need maxed anyway, at your level.

Nay, you shouldn't do that. Spikes aren't much, but are still something. You probably have all the support abilities you really need maxed anyway, at your level.

Not really no, some upgrades open up at level 350 and I'd rather have those than a 10%-not-additional-damage that I thought was a 100%-dodge-stopper.

Hey, don't just say something is true just by saying "I did the math and tested it". Show us at least the math part or a clear explanation of why it is superior.

....

Obviously, I was trolling. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

Well... Although I was hoping for the big fish, but seeing that you're quite desperate in your post, I'll tell you— I didn't actually calculated anything at all, but the logic of my theory can be written into a formula or whatever to see the number for yourself if you people are bored enough... (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

It's actually quite simple, really:

# Missed attack, like evaded attack, do not proc the spike effect
—> Lesser probability of spike to proc = Higher probability for an existing proc on the mob to expire
—> Higher probability of taking more damage

Since this flaw exist only on wind spike and not on fire spike while otherwise they're the same, therefore I concluded that, in theory, fire spike is superior than wind for reducing incoming dmg.

This post has been edited by buktore: Jan 15 2014, 01:19

But on the other hand, fire spike does nothing aganist those skills that hit you for more than your full HP, where wind spike would help the most - it is like 10% more evade*.

*Barring it actually making monsters miss due accuracy and stuff.

But on the other hand, fire spike does nothing aganist those skills that hit you for more than your full HP, where wind spike would help the most - it is like 10% more evade*.

Oh for fuck's sake, not this 'PMI vs Evade' bullshit again... (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

This post has been edited by buktore: Jan 15 2014, 08:50

(IMG:[images.mylittlefacewhen.com] http://images.mylittlefacewhen.com/media/f/img/mlfw297_1298755588459.jpg)

But on the other hand, fire spike does nothing aganist those skills that hit you for more than your full HP, where wind spike would help the most - it is like 10% more evade*.

*Barring it actually making monsters miss due accuracy and stuff.

Actually, if it hits for less than 111.11% of your HP and your bar is full, Searing Skin will prevent a KO. Anyway, always prefer stability over variation when the average averted damage is the same.

# Missed attack, like evaded attack, do not proc the spike effect
—> Lesser probability of spike to proc = Higher probability for an existing proc on the mob to expire
—> Higher probability of taking more damage

Since this flaw exist only on wind spike and not on fire spike while otherwise they're the same, therefore I concluded that, in theory, fire spike is superior than wind for reducing incoming dmg.

That looks like a valid point. One more point in favor of Fire Spikes over Wind Spikes.

This post has been edited by Dan31: Jan 15 2014, 13:22

I have a question about magical mitigation. Is it any important now? Is it useful after the recent patches?

What I mean is that very very rarely I see a resist check and when I take a look at monsters in the monster lab wiki, they all can choose to release their skills as physical, be it fire, holy or void.
My main problem is that I thought magical mitigation and resist should usually be the way to protect oneself against elemental attacks, but that seems to be no longer the case, making them pretty useless.

I'm asking too because I have the doubt about what will help my sprite and celestial monsters take more wins. Physical or magical skills for the monsters?