[X] My Assistant

Right.

If you don't mind, I will add a bit of your text to the advice page on wiki.

Knock yourself out (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
You may want to move it down, past the general mage advice, as it's less of a getting started, as more of a getting started past 310 (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)
Also, it might be better to remove references to scripts and values of gear/consumables, as they tend to change. Actually, reading it in the context of the page, it seems a little advanced in comparison or is this just me? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

This post has been edited by simrock87: Feb 26 2017, 14:20

Also, it might be better to remove references to scripts and values of gear/consumables, as they tend to change.

agree. that page may potentially need changes/fixes with every patch (sadly! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) ), let's not make things too complicated and pretending to read the market as well. if any, you can still put a "it's pretty cheap for what it does", "it has a high benefit/cost ratio" or so

This post has been edited by Scremaz: Feb 26 2017, 14:25

mage weapon section (§7.3): add something like "when picking a staff, consider that prefix, slot name and suffix have all to match. prefix are all available, but suffixes aren't."
maybe throw in an example. it's not like i pretend for all beginners to understand (it's not that easy for a starter), just giving a hint that you need to choose what to pick (ie: not a shocking katalox of earth-walker if you want to go dark) is fine.

mage abilities section (§7.6): i guess holy/dark mages can earn something from spike shields as well, but i don't know which ones to suggest. maybe elec for reduced resist? wind for reduced evade? plus i guess also Better Arcane Focus is suggested, but SP theft only comes as a part of rather complicated play styles

melee weapons (§8.3): DW: i would mention only the viable mainstream combos. maybe mention the other ones as curiosity, just to let people know that there's something to play with, but not everything together. for example, it sounds strange to me that all those rapier/waki combos can work (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) but it's been a while since i last played with anything different than rapier slaughter/waki nimble, so i may be wrong...

perk section (§13): Resplendent Regeneration -> Effluent Ether -> Vigorous Vitality -> Suffusive Spirit
really?
still need to check section 14 onwards. guess i'll do it after lunch.

also, i did a bit of fixes here and there but something may have slipped. in particular, the fact that both mage and melee sections have all the needed links (ie to weapon and armor pages) should be checked.

All comments processed. I updated the Hath Perk section quite a bit.

seems fine. i mean, until the perk section.

meanwhile, wiki joe passed and did some fixes. i see even a few relevant ones, like 120~230 bytes. just for you to know.

I try to keep that article as brief as possible, it's already far too long for most newbies to read.

I try to keep that article as brief as possible, it's already far too long for most newbies to read.

i'll assume your trend is to give only a few hints in that page and then let newbies come to ask the experts for many clarifications, right? agreeable, but i hoped that re-building that page could've spared some newbies to ask the usual things in that thread or open new threads with only one small question, even at the cost of writing a couple more words.
it's not wrong - of course, that's what that thread is up for - but when people keep going and ask for the same things... guess we'll need a compromise... maybe i'll add the too-long-for-wiki concepts as sort of advanced strategies in the "Getting Started" guide...

This post has been edited by Scremaz: Feb 26 2017, 17:32

i'll assume your trend is to give only a few hints in that page and then let newbies come to ask the experts for many clarifications, right? agreeable, but i hoped that re-building that page could've spared some newbies to ask the usual things in that thread or open new threads with only one small question, even at the cost of writing a couple more words.
it's not wrong - of course, that's what that thread is up for - but when people keep going and ask for the same things... guess we'll need a compromise... maybe i'll add the too-long-for-wiki concepts as sort of advanced strategies in the "Getting Started" guide...

We could easily move some bits to the forum. But I agree with Scemaz that the wiki can be used for questions that are often asked.

I'll let you Mods decide: if you want it way shorter, I can do that for you too. Just say the word.

We could easily move some bits to the forum. But I agree with Scemaz that the wiki can be used for questions that are often asked.

I'll let you Mods decide: if you want it way shorter, I can do that for you too. Just say the word.

let's take that as a hint from an admin. if you can shorten it a bit, it's good. the good ideas that were cut from that article will be put as FAQ either here or in wiki FAQ, even at the cost of being redundant. better twice than never.

This post has been edited by Scremaz: Feb 26 2017, 17:48

Why not add a new wiki page with the more advanced information?
Call it advanced advice or somesuch and link it at the bottom?

Why not add a new wiki page with the more advanced information?
Call it advanced advice or somesuch and link it at the bottom?

something like this, just on wiki?

something like this, just on wiki?

That could work. The editing done by Joe was minor and helps to make it better readable. It is still long. Actually a good idea to have "advice" and "advanced advice" on wiki I think.

something like this, just on wiki?

Exactly, just on wiki, so it's easier to find if you don't visit the forum (didn't for the first couple months of HV myself) and it'll be easier to edit over time.

Exactly, just on wiki, so it's easier to find if you don't visit the forum (didn't for the first couple months of HV myself) and it'll be easier to edit over time.

at this point, what to do with old f4tal's getting started? simply keep it as a collection of links?

at this point, what to do with old f4tal's getting started? simply keep it as a collection of links?

First of all, the following is just me blabbing my thoughts, they may not be that coherent (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

We sort of have two information ways at the moment, the forum and the wiki.

Imho the wiki is best for static information, that does not change often and does not require feedback, so this would fit the FAQ, getting started and so on. The advantage for the wiki is searchability (will come back to that later, also i know that is not a word((IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif))) and that multiple authors can collaborate without having to redo everything.

The Forum on the other hand does give the option for responses, so it'd be better suited for question and answer issues, and of course the whole off topic thing (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/happy.gif), if an issue comes up that is not easily answered by the wiki.

Both systems only work if they are updated regularly. So far this was mainly the forums only as we're stalking it anyway, but with quite some people having volunteered to put some love into the wiki side, this looks better now than in the past.

Again, just my thoughts, but if the wiki side gets up to scratch wouldn't it be sufficient to just have one pinned topic with links that point toward the relevant threads and wiki pages?
As i don't have the free time to contribute to much right now, i'm just throwing ideas around here for those that actually have to do the work (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)

PS: Did anyone notice, that you can't really search AtE anymore as you just get too many hits for pretty much any search term you use, and the most useful answers stay hidden, because they are too new? Just to make your job that little bit harder, would it be beneficial to split AtE by HV versions? (personally i'd prefer a discussion on this topic if possible, as i wouldn't be able to decide myself from the pro's and con's i can think of right now. Also to not split now, but just if/when a new version comes along in the future, not for the whole thing up to now, that ship has sailed imo and the thread would seem ... dreary for the time remaining)

First of all, the following is just me blabbing my thoughts, they may not be that coherent (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

We sort of have two information ways at the moment, the forum and the wiki.

Imho the wiki is best for static information, that does not change often and does not require feedback, so this would fit the FAQ, getting started and so on. The advantage for the wiki is searchability (will come back to that later, also i know that is not a word((IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif))) and that multiple authors can collaborate without having to redo everything.

The Forum on the other hand does give the option for responses, so it'd be better suited for question and answer issues, and of course the whole off topic thing (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/happy.gif), if an issue comes up that is not easily answered by the wiki.

Both systems only work if they are updated regularly. So far this was mainly the forums only as we're stalking it anyway, but with quite some people having volunteered to put some love into the wiki side, this looks better now than in the past.

Again, just my thoughts, but if the wiki side gets up to scratch wouldn't it be sufficient to just have one pinned topic with links that point toward the relevant threads and wiki pages?
As i don't have the free time to contribute to much right now, i'm just throwing ideas around here for those that actually have to do the work (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)

so basically you propose to keep wiki for "static" things and for referrals to how the system works, and the forum for a bit more detailed/dynamic explanations. in case nothing of those is helpful, go ask in ask the experts for a personal solution. did i understand right?

PS: Did anyone notice, that you can't really search AtE anymore as you just get too many hits for pretty much any search term you use, and the most useful answers stay hidden, because they are too new? Just to make your job that little bit harder, would it be beneficial to split AtE by HV versions? (personally i'd prefer a discussion on this topic if possible, as i wouldn't be able to decide myself from the pro's and con's i can think of right now. Also to not split now, but just if/when a new version comes along in the future, not for the whole thing up to now, that ship has sailed imo and the thread would seem ... dreary for the time remaining)

yep, noted it. not sure about pros and cons myself. but for sure, better to wait for a new version, just in case. and according to tenboro, new version isn't so near...

so basically you propose to keep wiki for "static" things and for referrals to how the system works, and the forum for a bit more detailed/dynamic explanations. in case nothing of those is helpful, go ask in ask the experts for a personal solution. did i understand right?

Yes. Though the forum bit would essentially be only questions that aren't covered then.

and according to tenboro, new version isn't so near...

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cry.gif) Was hoping for the usual April/May update (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)
(just checked, it seems i had a wrong impression, the actual dates were all over the place (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif))

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cry.gif) Was hoping for the usual April/May update (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)
(just checked, it seems i had a wrong impression, the actual dates were all over the place (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif))

they are. well, before starting all this, i asked him if there were any news. no news apart for the build number. guess that, if nothing else this means we have a bit of time to update all these things.

You can generally break things down into 3 groups:
- New players (have 0 knowledge of anything HV)
- Intermediate players (questions on features like forging, drop rates, and Innate Arcana)
- Advanced players (questions about optimization, best returns, and min-maxing)

If there is to be any split of the page it should be to make the article strictly for the first group and moving the rest elsewhere.

i like this. then something like: group 1 on wiki, group 2 and 3 here?

You can generally break things down into 3 groups:
- New players (have 0 knowledge of anything HV)
- Intermediate players (questions on features like forging, drop rates, and Innate Arcana)
- Advanced players (questions about optimization, best returns, and min-maxing)

If there is to be any split of the page it should be to make the article strictly for the first group and moving the rest elsewhere.

Or the "pls gib credits ned ddl gallery" type players. I think most of the information for intermediate+ players are accessible you try hard enough eg. searching through the Ask the experts thread. There is only so much you can spoon-feed leechers people~