[X] My Assistant

Thanks! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

No prob. Your script rocks! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

What kind of PL do you encounter on hard?

Hey who's got time to do IW on a kite shield?

What kind of PL do you encounter on hard?

If you're asking me, I see a lot of gc00018's, Jenga's, and Mao's.
But I think that's because they have a bunch of monsters, and I'm used to their naming sequences.

Oh... and ssss2's pop up a quite a bit.

I've never seen mine. But I only have 24 and only one of those over PL1000. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cry.gif)

I po monster owner! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cry.gif) (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cry.gif) ("he sobbed as he bought 70 crystal packs today. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif) )

Hey who's got time to do IW on a kite shield?

I wouldn't waste time with a kite shield without dex.
And without forgetting that it's a kite shield.

And last but not least...Iwing a shield is almost useless (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

If you're asking me, I see a lot of gc00018's, Jenga's, and Mao's.
But I think that's because they have a bunch of monsters, and I'm used to their naming sequences.

Oh... and ssss2's pop up a quite a bit.

I've never seen mine. But I only have 24 and only one of those over PL1000. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cry.gif)

I po monster owner! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cry.gif) (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cry.gif) ("he sobbed as he bought 70 crystal packs today. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif) )

So do you still encounter only above 1000 PL?

This post has been edited by ppp82p: Oct 17 2016, 03:15

I wouldn't waste time with a kite shield without dex.
And without forgetting that it's a kite shield.

And last but not least...Iwing a shield is almost useless (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

Yep... no dex = junk, kite above 350 = junk, iw on shield = junk

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

So do you still encounter only above 1000 PL?

I still occasionally see monsters below 1000 PL, and very very rarely monsters below 900 PL, when playing on IWBTH and PF

Yep... no dex = junk, kite above 350 = junk, iw on shield = junk

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)
I still occasionally see monsters below 1000 PL, and very very rarely monsters below 900 PL, when playing on IWBTH and PF

nobody likes kite (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

and i guess kite need some love from 10b (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/anime_cry.gif)

[hvlist.niblseed.com] 13

wow , already reach 2 digit (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

I wonder who is/was first to the 10 digits bankroll (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

many months ago , HD have 600M+ (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

if he still active grinding , maybe he will reach 1B credits (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)


we can always ask tenb about this (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/duck.gif)

This post has been edited by nobody_xxx: Oct 17 2016, 03:58

So do you still encounter only above 1000 PL?

I don't think I ever see less than PL1000. Ever.

Of course I'm assuming the guys I mentioned all have their monsters above 1000.
(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Which they do. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

What kind of PL do you encounter on hard?

In my case, only encounter monsters above PL 1000.

Can anyone tell if, under PL 1000, is there a corresponding track with certain levels of players? For example, up to what level someone confronts a monster with PL <100 (which are most of our monsters)? And a PL 500?

In my case, only encounter monsters above PL 1000.

Can anyone tell if, under PL 1000, is there a corresponding track with certain levels of players? For example, up to what level someone confronts a monster with PL <100 (which are most of our monsters)? And a PL 500?

Wiki has the equation. There's a bit of uncertainty, and I'm not sure of the behavior when (level + difficulty) = max PL possible, but it'll probably give you a decent idea.

But I'm nearly certain you still do encounter monsters below 1000 - it's just unusual.

Only you can help datamine to unlock the secrets of the HV, which I may share someday if you unlock enough of them.

I wouldn't waste time with a kite shield without dex.
And without forgetting that it's a kite shield.

Well, hey, at least I don't get scammed into shelling out extra credits for Defense Matrix Modulators to get to the same block %. Though if I want to increase my odds of raising my elem/holy profs the ludicrously high ITR of force shields might be of slight help...

Well, hey, at least I don't get scammed into shelling out extra credits for Defense Matrix Modulators to get to the same block %. Though if I want to increase my odds of raising my elem/holy profs the ludicrously high ITR of force shields might be of slight help...

Disregarding the lack of Dex, considering upgrading one stat only, comparing a 36 block (~= Lmax) Kite against a 38 block (~= 80th percentile) Force, assuming 50k to buy each equip, assuming DMM @ 10k and HGW @ 10k:
I did the math


The top sheet is the Kite, the bottom sheet is the Force. All that really matters is the numbers in the rightmost column, which is (stat after forging) / (forge cost + 50k), aka "benefit / cost". As you can see, for a given forge level, block per credit invested is always higher for the Kite, even at forge level 50.

I thought Force was almost always better, but I was wrong.

The Scientific Method™
(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

---

(but if you upgrade multiple stats rather than just block, you can consider the DMM cost to be around divided by the number of stats upgraded, and the DMM term nearly disappears, and Force blows Kite out of the water at higher forge levels)

Disregarding the lack of Dex, considering upgrading one stat only, comparing a 36 block (~= Lmax) Kite against a 38 block (~= 80th percentile) Force, assuming 50k to buy each equip, assuming DMM @ 10k and HGW @ 10k:
I did the math


The top sheet is the Kite, the bottom sheet is the Force. All that really matters is the numbers in the rightmost column, which is (stat after forging) / (forge cost + 50k), aka "benefit / cost". As you can see, for a given forge level, block per credit invested is always higher for the Kite, even at forge level 50.

I thought Force was almost always better, but I was wrong.

The Scientific Method™
(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

---

(but if you upgrade multiple stats rather than just block, you can consider the DMM cost to be around divided by the number of stats upgraded, and the DMM term nearly disappears, and Force blows Kite out of the water at higher forge levels)

nice one. as always.

The top sheet is the Kite, the bottom sheet is the Force. All that really matters is the numbers in the rightmost column, which is (stat after forging) / (forge cost + 50k), aka "benefit / cost". As you can see, for a given forge level, block per credit invested is always higher for the Kite, even at forge level 50.

I thought Force was almost always better, but I was wrong.

But that way you are comparing the two based on a useless stat (forge levels means nothing to the player).
You should compare the benefit/cost at same block percentage.
At 48 block kite is at 0.02154, force is at 0.03353, so it's much cheaper to reach the same block using force shield (so what we always assumed as correct).

Basically you weren't wrong (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)

Disregarding the lack of Dex, considering upgrading one stat only, comparing a 36 block (~= Lmax) Kite against a 38 block (~= 80th percentile) Force, assuming 50k to buy each equip, assuming DMM @ 10k and HGW @ 10k:
I did the math


The top sheet is the Kite, the bottom sheet is the Force. All that really matters is the numbers in the rightmost column, which is (stat after forging) / (forge cost + 50k), aka "benefit / cost". As you can see, for a given forge level, block per credit invested is always higher for the Kite, even at forge level 50.

I thought Force was almost always better, but I was wrong.

The Scientific Method™
(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

---

(but if you upgrade multiple stats rather than just block, you can consider the DMM cost to be around divided by the number of stats upgraded, and the DMM term nearly disappears, and Force blows Kite out of the water at higher forge levels)

Wait, what if they both start out at 36?

Wait, what if they both start out at 36?

Then the player with the equip should salvage on sight, since that's not to far from Force's Lmin block.

Looking at recent auctions, even pretty high block Force above 400 often doesn't sell at all, or gets only minimum bid. So I considered 38 block = 80th percentile = 50k is an OK guesstimate.

Error 503 Service Unavailable bypass

Oops, my bad, comparing each at the same forge level implies nothing useful.

Kite forged block catches up to Force's base block at Kite forge 3.1, Kite of course costs more per block% overall
Kite costs 100k @ forge 8.25 => 40.3 block, Force 100k @ forge 5.7 => 41.4 block
Kite 300k @ 14 => 42.3 block. Force 300k @ 11 => 43.6 block
Kite 1m @ 26.5 => 45.3 block. Force 1m @ 23 => 47 block

I'm sure there's a better way to do that, oh well. Difference keeps widening. Kite is never better. Difference is even wider when you forge more than one attribute.

So I guess that's the reason why almost all Kite doesn't even get minimum bid

This post has been edited by Superlatanium: Oct 17 2016, 11:01

nobody likes kite (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

and i guess kite need some love from 10b (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/anime_cry.gif)

re-introducing Barrier suffix, so Block from Kite of Barrier = Block from Force would be enough.


as for Force vs. Kite, the only advantage in using a P-like Kite against a Force is that you would spare matrixes. all the other costs are pretty much the same.
but if you consider how rare (read: expensive) P-like Kites and Matrixes worth only 8~10k (less than Shade fragments!), all the benefits go out of the window. let's say you'll upgrade Block and PABs, it's only +2k per stat. even less if you throw in MMI or PMI. same forge gains (on percentage), higher starting point. there shouldn't be problems realizing which one will earn the upper hand.

if he still active grinding , maybe he will reach 1B credits (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
we can always ask tenb about this (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)

pretty sure he will gladly ask you. and i'm also pretty sure the entity of the wallets of other users isn't our business, if they don't want to share with us such infos to begin with.

Spoiler text - Highlight to read...

btw, whining every time about being poor is a good way to lure everyone into looking into your trades.

Only you can help datamine to unlock the secrets of the HV, which I may share someday if you unlock enough of them.

well, having the mind to process them is already a big conquer, i'd say

Kite forged block catches up to Force's base block at Kite forge 3.1, Kite of course costs more per block% overall
Kite costs 100k @ forge 8.25 => 40.3 block, Force 100k @ forge 5.7 => 41.4 block
Kite 300k @ 14 => 42.3 block. Force 300k @ 11 => 43.6 block
Kite 1m @ 26.5 => 45.3 block. Force 1m @ 23 => 47 block

I'm sure there's a better way to do that, oh well. Difference keeps widening. Kite is never better. Difference is even wider when you forge more than one attribute.

exactly. in order to make up for such forever-widening gap, Kites should have at least a higher Block to start with and keeping all the other stats at the same level as they already are. at that point, the slightly higher BUR of Kites would be bear-able.
but we already have Forces and Bucklers of Barrier, so i don't really think it's a priority.


btw, could you please add something like "snip" on Sapo's quote? the system doesn't like when you quote posts with empty quotes.