[X] My Assistant

Is it possible to allow selecting/copying text in Market log? I am not sure if that's my setting issue or what.

It's not a settings issue on your end. It's due to a property set in the CSS for the market. Why it's in the CSS for the market is something only our dear leader can answer, but the obvious corellary to it's existence is that they do not want us to be able to easily copy that text.

My guess is that it's part of a strategy to make it harder to automate market activity, which our illustrious leader has (reasonably, I think) banned, and to enhance the ability to detect bad actors in the market. That said, I don't think that this particular CSS setting accomplishes very much in that regard. It raises the bar quite minimally, and can be evaded trivially even without scripts, by simply saving the page.

It's just a no select CSS rule that was applied to the top-level market element, but yeah, the logs probably should be selectable. For now you can trivially disable it with the dev inspector (F12 in your browser) or a userscript by overriding/disabling the user-select:none rule from #market_outer

One of the very nice features of HVMarket that the current market implementation lacks was the ability to look at a complete logs of sales for ourselves, other players and each item. This allowed for some market inteligence and thoughtful price setting, taking into account historical activity and market trends. Because it
was accessible to everyone, it helped level the playing feild between some of the more deep pocketed players and those with less funds, but time to devote to analysis.

? those logs are all available.

? those logs are all available.

I... yes. Yes they are. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

I was somehow confused. I could swear the market logs only showed a limited time period, with older entries dropped 0ff, but that is clearly not the case.

My apologies.

This post has been edited by sogeth: Jul 25 2022, 14:00

As far as I can tell, the player stock and price/trade history on the item trading page are both updating instantly when a trade is executed, but let me know if you (or anyone else) see this again, and if so, exactly what you did.

You may see a slight delay (up to 5 seconds) for the trade lists under Browse Items and My Sell/Buy Orders to reflect any order/stock changes, this is expected.

I bought a Mysterious Box on the market. The item was listed by a seller, and I updated my buy offer to meet their price. My market log shows the transaction at 22:01. As of this posting, the recent trades page for the item still shows no trades.

I think what is in common with this and the last time I saw a problem is that this is the first time a trade for the item has occurred.

Edit: If I manually visit the item trade log, it shows up there. It's just the price history on the main item page not updating.

This post has been edited by kamio11: Jul 26 2022, 00:16

scroll of absorption, low-grade cloth and low-grade cloth apparently don't sell well in persistent market, the minimum sell order is already is 10c, and they seem actually worth less, it needs to be changed.

I bought a Mysterious Box on the market. The item was listed by a seller, and I updated my buy offer to meet their price. My market log shows the transaction at 22:01. As of this posting, the recent trades page for the item still shows no trades.

I think what is in common with this and the last time I saw a problem is that this is the first time a trade for the item has occurred.

Edit: If I manually visit the item trade log, it shows up there. It's just the price history on the main item page not updating.

I had noticed that on the Solstice Gift, actually it will should up immediately if there is another change on that item, like someone submit another bid. Base on tenboro's reply I guess the Recent Trades work slightly slower than the item page update, so it end out into the "otherwise" case which cached for an hour if there is no other transaction on that item. It not really a big problem as anyway it will showup

scroll of absorption, low-grade cloth and low-grade cloth apparently don't sell well in persistent market, the minimum sell order is already is 10c, and they seem actually worth less, it needs to be changed.

I don't think that's necessery, they don't sell well because people don't use them, and they're not the staple items which can drops alot, even the price end out with market equilibrium you will only earn few thousands, so why bothering that much on that. You can also sell them in forum or dump them into the item shop if you really want to get rid of them

This post has been edited by what_is_name: Jul 26 2022, 06:51

I bought a Mysterious Box on the market. The item was listed by a seller, and I updated my buy offer to meet their price. My market log shows the transaction at 22:01. As of this posting, the recent trades page for the item still shows no trades.

I think what is in common with this and the last time I saw a problem is that this is the first time a trade for the item has occurred.

Edit: If I manually visit the item trade log, it shows up there. It's just the price history on the main item page not updating.

I tried selling a different item that didn't have any trades, but it did update right away, so I'm not sure it's related. I can't see any obvious issues with the caching logic, but I'll keep an eye out for it.

scroll of absorption, low-grade cloth and low-grade cloth apparently don't sell well in persistent market, the minimum sell order is already is 10c, and they seem actually worth less, it needs to be changed.

Items can't be made batch unless they are also made staple, and doing it after launch would be a bit of a pain in the first place. I expect scrolls to become more useful (or at least easier to use) in the future, which should fix the former, and I might make some other changes to increase demand of low-grade mats as well.

Minor update:

- Added a "Trade Log" tab that takes you directly to your own trading log. This is effectively the same screen as the one linked on the trading screen and can be navigated just like it.

- "Market Log" was renamed "Account Log".

- Clicking the "Stock" readout will now auto-fill the sell count field with the maximum sellable stock.

- Log pages now have selectable text.

When I want to quickly buy/sell something, I need to look at the sell/buy list, that as seen in this ordering, is actually not below where I'm writing the order.
Whether it's good or bad is definitely subjective, but I wonder how most users use that?

I remember there were some people who complained about "bidwar" and "resellers". On this subject I thought of something that, despite not preventing it, makes this resale operation more laborious.

It would be enough to prevent a person from creating purchase and sale orders at the same time for the same item. A purchase can only be made if that person does not have a sale order, and vice versa.

Resellers will continue to exist, but they will only be able to perform one operation at a time, that is, they will have to sell the entire stock before they can make a new purchase order (and vice versa). This resale operation would no longer be "automatic/instantaneous".

Could this be done?

When I want to quickly buy/sell something, I need to look at the sell/buy list, that as seen in this ordering, is actually not below where I'm writing the order.

The first iteration of the market interface actually had the sell/buy interface over the opposite sell/buy order lists, but it was just wonky. Ultimately it just made more sense to have the sell interface over the sell orders and vice versa. Either way you do it, you'll be interacting with the opposite column when you do the other of the actions.

I remember there were some people who complained about "bidwar" and "resellers". On this subject I thought of something that, despite not preventing it, makes this resale operation more laborious.

It would be enough to prevent a person from creating purchase and sale orders at the same time for the same item. A purchase can only be made if that person does not have a sale order, and vice versa.

You want to ban any potential market makers? Because that would just make the whole experience worse for everyone. If someone is able to eke out a profit with the 1% trade fee in place, more power to them.

- Clicking the "Stock" readout will now auto-fill the sell count field with the maximum sellable stock.

If I put in a price first, then click "Stock," it won't let me click the "Place Sell Order" button until I reconfirm my sell count or ask price.

You want to ban any potential market makers? Because that would just make the whole experience worse for everyone. If someone is able to eke out a profit with the 1% trade fee in place, more power to them.

Not personally. It turns out that I remembered that this was a recurring subject at the time of Hentai Verse Market, and I also remember that someone suggested limiting the number of changes in bidding per day. So I was looking at some transactions, and thought of this "possible solution". If you think it's not good, that's fine.

But I just thought of a hypothetical situation. What if, for example, a dealer puts the purchase and sale prices very close? Okay, he wouldn't have a very large profit, but in that case he wouldn't be controlling the price of the goods?

Market makers (resellers) were a pain in hvmarket due to constantly adjusting their prices to beat you by 1 credit. This behavior is greatly limited thanks to Tenboro's changes (min undercut/overbid, limit on how frequently you can change prices). Actually market making benefits the community by providing liquidity. If you want to buy or sell a large amount, market makers provide the large volume buy/sell orders to handle that.

If I put in a price first, then click "Stock," it won't let me click the "Place Sell Order" button until I reconfirm my sell count or ask price.

Should be fixed now.

But I just thought of a hypothetical situation. What if, for example, a dealer puts the purchase and sale prices very close? Okay, he wouldn't have a very large profit, but in that case he wouldn't be controlling the price of the goods?

I'm not concerned about people using the market to make some credits, but if someone did that they would *lose* credits from each trade.

- Added a "Trade Log" tab that takes you directly to your own trading log. This is effectively the same screen as the one linked on the trading screen and can be navigated just like it.

- Clicking the "Stock" readout will now auto-fill the sell count field with the maximum sellable stock.

These are things I didn't know I wanted but I'm glad we got them, particularly the second one. Thx!

Can we have,
A screen that shows all the items in the market sorted by the current spread, specifically Min Undercut divided by Min Overbid, and what that ratio is. That would make it much faster to find the items currently in need of "market making".

+/- and green/red color coding in the Total column for player trade logs, like in the Credit Log

In the trade log, a little arrow ↗ after the item to go directly to the item listing, so we don't have to click through the item trade log first. Since items fall off the My Buy Orders/My Sell Orders view when they're fully filled, I'm using the trade log to remember what items I need to go recreate buy orders & update sell orders on, and going directly would save clicks.

The approximate total value of our market stock computed & listed somewhere, using the Day Avg prices.

This post has been edited by Necromusume: Jul 31 2022, 03:13

Will the tooltips explaining the items in the Item Shop make it into The Market eventually?

In the market, can you make it so switching between tabs on the left of the screen (browse items, my buy orders, etc) doesn't automatically switch to consumables? When I'm buying a bunch of materials I end up switching a couple times between browse items and my buy orders and have to switch back to materials every time. Or maybe add columns in browse items for your own bids so I don't have to switch to my buy orders to see what I've already bid on and at what price? I use browse items to find what I can buy or sell, so some information on what I'm already buying or selling would be a big help. Thanks a bunch for the market and continuing to improve it.

Not sure it'd be called a bug more than a convenience suggestion, but selecting show only sellable stock, then selling items to buy now prices (by just setting price to 10 every time), and going through your items one by one works fine, but once you skip an item, in my case scrap cloth, every item thereafter clicking the forward button takes you back to the last item skipped/item you still have quantity for previous in the list to the current item, when you fully sell the stock of the current item, instead of going forward. It's just a case of clicking forward twice after every sale then which isn't the end of the world, but if it's trivial enough to change, would be great.

A screen that shows all the items in the market sorted by the current spread, specifically Min Undercut divided by Min Overbid, and what that ratio is. That would make it much faster to find the items currently in need of "market making".

The approximate total value of our market stock computed & listed somewhere, using the Day Avg prices.

These are kinda fringe but should be easy enough to do as a userscript if someone cares enough.

+/- and green/red color coding in the Total column for player trade logs, like in the Credit Log

Uh, since the trade log is basically a credit transfer between two accounts, having it as + or - doesn't make any sense.

In the trade log, a little arrow ↗ after the item to go directly to the item listing, so we don't have to click through the item trade log first. Since items fall off the My Buy Orders/My Sell Orders view when they're fully filled, I'm using the trade log to remember what items I need to go recreate buy orders & update sell orders on, and going directly would save clicks.

Yeah, that makes sense. Should be added now.

Will the tooltips explaining the items in the Item Shop make it into The Market eventually?

Probably not, it's not really necessary and I'd rather not add unnecessary clutter.

In the market, can you make it so switching between tabs on the left of the screen (browse items, my buy orders, etc) doesn't automatically switch to consumables? When I'm buying a bunch of materials I end up switching a couple times between browse items and my buy orders and have to switch back to materials every time. Or maybe add columns in browse items for your own bids so I don't have to switch to my buy orders to see what I've already bid on and at what price? I use browse items to find what I can buy or sell, so some information on what I'm already buying or selling would be a big help. Thanks a bunch for the market and continuing to improve it.

Yeah, that makes sense to me. Should be added now. (It won't remember the other filtering options since those aren't applicable to the "my orders" screen.)

Not sure it'd be called a bug more than a convenience suggestion, but selecting show only sellable stock, then selling items to buy now prices (by just setting price to 10 every time), and going through your items one by one works fine, but once you skip an item, in my case scrap cloth, every item thereafter clicking the forward button takes you back to the last item skipped/item you still have quantity for previous in the list to the current item, when you fully sell the stock of the current item, instead of going forward. It's just a case of clicking forward twice after every sale then which isn't the end of the world, but if it's trivial enough to change, would be great.

Hmm. I think I see what you mean, and I made a small fix to the itemlist filtering that should improve the behavior when an item gets removed from the list while you are looking at it. Let me know if that fixed it for you.

(Also fixed missing digit separation for credit amounts for min overbid/undercut as well as the order total.)