[X] My Assistant

Inflation on GP doesn't necessary mean it's bad. In fact, inflation is an indicator for growing economy. I personally would like to see an equipment sink while increasing the chances of drops. So that godly gears will be very hard to obtain while decent gears easily. This will also cut down the deficit between poor and rich. Also these equips will get outdated in the future like it was before. If the rich takes all the tickets, it means that the poor would get more income from selling GP.

Another thing I want to point out is when grand prize is something salvage worthy, there's no point holding a lottery on that day as it's just a redistribution of tickets, which is a real disappointment. So extending the prizes to 3 at least will increase the chance of something being useful come out of it and will have people something to look forward to. Another thing I want to point out is the imbalance between weapon/gear drop rate. Should we assume the information on wiki is correct, there are more weapons dropped per slot than gears.

What if the gp holder are the richs?

^They are, note that the context used was under the assumption of significant inflation on GP. There will be less incentive for the poor to hold on the tickets. Price increases, offer follows.

Uno is right on this one.
once buying some tickets is better for getting gear than playing the game something went wrong.

Also jelly guys should stop whining about Stony winning some Gears. This guy is contributing a lot to 'win' so just contribute yourself if you want these drops... Or wait until he has everything and stops (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

But why would the poor use their GP for lottery if the lottery was meant to be a sink for who don't know what to do with their GP? And about inflation, I don't think GP will inflate. It's not like those 'rich' people betting in the lottery buy their GP in the GP exchange. Since 50% of the GP pot returns to runner-ups, some of them end up selling their GP in the GP exchange. So it goes full circle and the cycle begins anew.

Also, why would you want the lottery to always spawn something 'useful'? If something useless spawns, that means more GP can be spent on the next item that's not useless. So there's no real effect on lottery being less of a GP sink because of not-so-useful spawns.

If armor were added into the lottery, that means more chances of mag+ cottons and leathers. I think people would rather get 20% of the GP pot than those disgusting things. If you're suggesting that it only spawns rare armors, that's just wrong. Do you seriously want the lottery to spawn 2 of Mag+ [Power of Slaughter]/[Phase Robe of <Element>]/[Shade of Shadowdancer], these 'useful' rare equipments, everyday?

Rare equipments are supposed to be rare. 'Useful' rare equipments are supposed to be rare among rares.
Is current lottery spawning rare equipments? Yes.
Is it spawning 'useful' rare equipments? Rarely.

Really, there's no need to change the lottery.

(Oh, by the way, I belong to the 'poor' category.)

If the rich takes all the tickets, it means that the poor would get more income from selling GP.

Have you seen those rich beastes buy GP? They got enough in other way. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

The problem of equipnment flood is that it reduces patch lifespan which means Tenb has to update much quicker. SO... it is almost impossible for one Tenb. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) SOOOOOOOOOOON® (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

Just my opinion as a holy mage (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

I don't really want to have a war about who is stronger and who should be nerf Warlock must die! (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) .

I just want some distinct difference between different mages which can reflect their characteristic.

For example, the holy mages can cure more is a good design~

Have you seen those rich beastes buy GP? They got enough in other way. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

The problem of equipnment flood is that it reduces patch lifespan which means Tenb has to update much quicker. SO... it is almost impossible for one Tenb. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) SOOOOOOOOOOON® (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

inb4 Elevenboro

Just my opinion as a holy mage (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

Holy deal more damage, holy cure more, holy use less mana.

Dark ... gets less damage with the same debuff as fire and we all know that fire is the most OP of the four elements (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) .

This post has been edited by danixxx: Nov 14 2013, 19:10

But why would the poor use their GP for lottery if the lottery was meant to be a sink for who don't know what to do with their GP? And about inflation, I don't think GP will inflate. It's not like those 'rich' people betting in the lottery buy their GP in the GP exchange. Since 50% of the GP pot returns to runner-ups, some of them end up selling their GP in the GP exchange. So it goes full circle and the cycle begins anew.

Also, why would you want the lottery to always spawn something 'useful'? If something useless spawns, that means more GP can be spent on the next item that's not useless. So there's no real effect on lottery being less of a GP sink because of not-so-useful spawns.

If armor were added into the lottery, that means more chances of mag+ cottons and leathers. I think people would rather get 20% of the GP pot than those disgusting things. If you're suggesting that it only spawns rare armors, that's just wrong. Do you seriously want the lottery to spawn 2 of Mag+ [Power of Slaughter]/[Phase Robe of <Element>]/[Shade of Shadowdancer], these 'useful' rare equipments, everyday?

Rare equipments are supposed to be rare. 'Useful' rare equipments are supposed to be rare among rares.
Is current lottery spawning rare equipments? Yes.
Is it spawning 'useful' rare equipments? Rarely.

Really, there's no need to change the lottery.

(Oh, by the way, I belong to the 'poor' category.)

I'm sorry, but you're just wrong, it will inflate, the main reason why it doesn't inflate now even though Peerless shows is the is as you said, because people save up on those days with useless prizes. The chance of having a useful item will increase a lot, thus will the pot, thus the sink, while the production stays the same. Let's say for the sake of example, we have a day with Peerless Estoc of Slaughter, Heimdall and Slaughter gear, you think the price won't skyrocket? The way lottery works now is just an item generator for the few elites without much benefit for the poor. Selling the few GP doesn't make a difference because of the low value. Statistically seen, the rich will place most of the times because they have the means, I'm not saying it's unfair. But a system should be designed for the majority, not for the minority. Just because they spawn rare items don't mean they will be useful, the chance of something being useful will increase though. Also, that's why I said it might be necessary to have an equipment sink.

Also, that's why I said it might be necessary to have an equipment sink.

While I do think it would be nice to have three grand prizes (where each winner is disqualified once they win one), with a bias towards armor pieces, I don't think ensuring one would be "desirable" in the current metagame would be worth the effort from a programming perspective. Besides, the current lottery seems to function adequately as a GP sink, so why should it change?

If additional GP sinks are desired, renting perks for GP seems a more direct approach, especially if it's paid out on a per-usage basis.

Then again, I think that you should be able to beat items out of your monsters, at a small cost of their happiness. For obvious reasons, that shouldn't include crystals, and the likelihood of a drop (and its quality) should be related to the monster's power level, so you can't just fill an empty slot with a monster named after someone you dislike on the forums and beat them like a candy-filled piñata to any benefit but your own mental health. It may also be helpful to make monsters with zero happiness die from misery after being beaten. This might be a little too much work, though.

Oh man wall of text coming through.

Let's say for the sake of example, we have a day with Peerless Estoc of Slaughter, Heimdall and Slaughter gear, you think the price won't skyrocket?

If something like that would happen, yes. The price would indeed skyrocket. And if prizes of similar value were hosted on the next days, GP prices would skyrocket so much that nobody but 'rich' people could buy GP. That's why you don't put Heimdall and Slaughter [and Phase] gear as the only rewards. My argument about inflation was about non-rare armor pieces being included in the rewards.

If non-rare armor pieces like cotton and leather were included, RNG would be too much of an arse to spawn something decent (just like current weapons). So people would be complaining about why they're getting cotton for being runner up instead of GP. In this case, there won't be any inflation because 'useful' items are still rare. It would only be adding more angry people about their cottons. There would also be cases where people would want to become runner-up instead of getting the Grand Prize.

Selling the few GP doesn't make a difference because of the low value. Statistically seen, the rich will place most of the times because they have the means, I'm not saying it's unfair.

The current value is good. Because if it inflates too much, people with GP income would be doing one of two things:
1. Sell their GP for high price. 'Poor' people won't like this.
2. Keep their GP and attempt to gamble against 'rich' people with said GP.

If you're trying to encourage 'poor' people to lottery, why promoting GP price increase? If it's for the sake of 'poor' people selling their GP for a higher price, then doesn't this mean that less people will participate in the lottery?

The way lottery works now is just an item generator for the few elites without much benefit for the poor.

But the lottery was designed for these 'elites'. As far as I know, for a long time GP was kinda useless so people who had GP income ended up accumulating GP for months. The lottery was introduced for these people because people can't use their GP outside Doggie Bag and GP exchange.

As for equipment sinks, Salvage is doing a pretty good job.

Oh man wall of text coming through.
If something like that would happen, yes. The price would indeed skyrocket. And if prizes of similar value were hosted on the next days, GP prices would skyrocket so much that nobody but 'rich' people could buy GP. That's why you don't put Heimdall and Slaughter [and Phase] gear as the only rewards. My argument about inflation was about non-rare armor pieces being included in the rewards.

If non-rare armor pieces like cotton and leather were included, RNG would be too much of an arse to spawn something decent (just like current weapons). So people would be complaining about why they're getting cotton for being runner up instead of GP. In this case, there won't be any inflation because 'useful' items are still rare. It would only be adding more angry people about their cottons. There would also be cases where people would want to become runner-up instead of getting the Grand Prize.
The current value is good. Because if it inflates too much, people with GP income would be doing one of two things:
1. Sell their GP for high price. 'Poor' people won't like this.
2. Keep their GP and attempt to gamble against 'rich' people with said GP.

If you're trying to encourage 'poor' people to lottery, why promoting GP price increase? If it's for the sake of 'poor' people selling their GP for a higher price, then doesn't this mean that less people will participate in the lottery?
But the lottery was designed for these 'elites'. As far as I know, for a long time GP was kinda useless so people who had GP income ended up accumulating GP for months. The lottery was introduced for these people because people can't use their GP outside Doggie Bag and GP exchange.

As for equipment sinks, Salvage is doing a pretty good job.

Adressing your first point, noone ever said something about Cotten or Leather, so not sure why you're bringing that up or in your precious post. That the fact that GP prices would skyrocket is favorable for the poor. Why? Because they don't have to gamble and hope for a miracle. Instead they'll have a steady flow of income. Even if they threw 10 ticket in the pot, they would still get a chance for that miracle to happen. Be it 0.0001% or 0.1%, you think it will make that much of a difference without tons of luck?

As for your second point, there is always a balance on the market, so saying the current price is good , bad, whether people like or dislike the price is just nonsense. For both of your points, how does the hypothetical future differ from the situation now? What can people do with GP except for selling or gambling? And I'm not encouraging anything, I'm just saying a system should be built with the majority in mind. No idea why you're so against that. Seems a mystery to me why you want a minority system when you're not even a part of it.

Lastly, just how exactly is salvaging an equipment sink? People only salvage old equips that have higher mat value than the piece itself. Sure they disappear, but calling that a sink? Really? Let's assume the current patch goes to time infinite, you think all the Peerless stuffs will sink?

This post has been edited by Oversoul: Nov 14 2013, 21:29

The problem of equipnment flood is that it reduces patch lifespan which means Tenb has to update much quicker. SO... it is almost impossible for one Tenb. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) SOOOOOOOOOOON® (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

I could add equipment wear?

I could add equipment wear?

And put to use all the extra low and mid grade materials we get from salvaging items. i.e. you would need mats to recover weapon/armour wear in the forge.

I could add equipment wear?

If you mean maintenance based on base PXP then that would be fine. Players would essentially be paying a tax to keep using more high-end gear.

- Kevlar Armor has been retired and rolled into Leather Armor, which now essentially has the strong points of both armors in one, except with slightly lower resist/crushing mitigation, and slightly higher interference.
-- Existing Kevlar can now be upgraded without the special component, which also no longer drops.

- Leather Armor elemental suffixes were switched to prefixes. Protection, Dampening, Deflection and Stoneskin suffixes were added.

If armor were added into the lottery, that means more chances of mag+ cottons and leathers. I think people would rather get 20% of the GP pot than those disgusting things.

People used to be happy enough to use Mag+ Kevlar. Is New Leather really that much worse, or do people just keep treating it like trash based on force of habit?

Maybe if when two tiers were rolled together, the name of the higher tier was kept, people would treat it completely differently?

And put to use all the extra low and mid grade materials we get from salvaging items. i.e. you would need mats to recover weapon/armour wear in the forge.

Not everyone salvages junk equipment.
I really hope HV isn't going to turn into a game that's 60% micromanagement and 40% actual playtime. Because that's where it looks like we're headed.

Not everyone salvages junk equipment.
I really hope HV isn't going to turn into a game that's 60% micromanagement and 40% actual playtime. Because that's where it looks like we're headed.

Can't grind right now, have to hem my robe and glue my staff back together, thanks Kodou Yuki (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Bah Humbug to that and Happy Grinding (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

People used to be happy enough to use Mag+ Kevlar. Is New Leather really that much worse, or do people just keep treating it like trash based on force of habit?

Maybe if when two tiers were rolled together, the name of the higher tier was kept, people would treat it completely differently?

I use leather...it sucks, it sucks so bad i wish people would lower the price more.

About my first point, yeah. Nobody did say anything about cottons and leathers. That's the problem. You said you wanted 2 rare armors as consolation prizes. You gave an example about peerless power and phase stuffs. You were implying that the consolation prizes were only Power, Phase and Shade gears. I'm just throwing Cottons and Leathers into the arguments.

My second point was about the effects of inflation to people. If you want a system built for the majority, yet this system is still only used by the same minority, I don't see the point of implementing it.

I consider lottery as a feature mainly for people who contributed a lot to this site. I also consider it as something not to be taken too seriously. Personally, I just drop some random GP into lottery as part of my OCD. I don't really care if I win something or not.

However, I am against the ideas of people that are trying to take the lottery too seriously. People that get angry for someone always winning or people who feel they are being left out. I don't understand why would someone do this.

and about Salvage, people salvage mag+ and forged stuffs too. If there are too many mag+ stuffs floating around in the market, eventually they will become salvage materials.

I think I will stop here. We clearly have different opinions of things. I guess we just see things different.