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Curiosity/Theorycrafting

Did any melee player ever tried starting the round with a T3?
And in particular with Paradise Lost.

Let's say we have a hallowed weapon (dark infused).
Magic damage of a melee class will probably be 2000 or even less, with holy damage bonus 43-45 and proficiency at 0 (or 0.1 in case of hath perk), even with full abilities the damage will not be impressive, but it will still hit up to 10 target, causing a lot of breached defence proc (10% less mitigation and 25 less dark mitigation).
I cannot test it (no decent hallowed weapon and 0 divine prof), but it would be interesting to see if it can work.

Oh the problem of a Caster Class Melee was not discussed for months now. Ok, Since I do have a full set of Arcanist, I may speak some facts about T3 spells with light armor worn.

1. Cast Speed
You do not have a Cast Speed Bonus, because you do not wear cloth. So you stick for a full 1.6 turns waving with your arms to actually get that spell cast. Since the HV minigame has the flaw advantage, that your damage is done first, then the (remaining) mobs are allowed to whack you within that 1.6 turn window. We are talking about a portion of difficulty, right? PFUDOR maybe? So the monsters have decent speed and that 1.6 window expands to 2+ turns.

2. Magical Damage and MAcc
Even with some Arcanist gear I am stuck at 1698 Magic Damage. Sure, I could now go and take Hallowed or other +Spell Damage weapons. Great, I choose to dual wield some hallowed one-handers. Oh, I am below 200 MAcc (145%), so I take Battlecaster suffixed one-handers... Still below 200%, but at least about 161%. Cool. Now I cast a T3 Paradise and get the CD. Hmm... How high are the chances I actually did hit all 10 or 9 of 10 or .. or 0 of 10? After that check I need to check for "resist", because even 1 damn Token enables that on the monster side (a zero token on that monster perk line and the resist mechanics is disabled!), so again the whole thing for resist... So we end up (and I guess here) about 4 to 6 out of 10 get hit. With the 75% chance for the proc we end up with 3 to 4.5 out of 10 will show the migitation reduction.

3. Defence / Offence
For getting 3 to 4.5 out of 10 mobs to have the proc we suffer big time from the weapons we chose to have that proc. We have hallowed - not ethereal - weapons with the battlecaster suffix. We use DW, but have a 2+ turn window to survive (no blinds, etc). With our awesome Magic we surely did not take out any mob with a single cast of Paradise. So we get 20+ attacks incoming which we are likely to take (at least say 5 to 7), because of our badly chosen suffixes.
On the Offence we suck big time. Even at IW max'ed weapons we surely wont get a decent kill speed to draw any fun out of this. Even OFC is related to ADB, so even there we suffer.

Conclusion: A T3 spell is something to do, when the battlefield can be controlled by the the skills, procs and spells you have at your disposal. I would not recommend changing weapons for this single T3 cast. You need a turn window of 1.6 turns, so you have to use FUS (which is silly, because you drop 10% DPS) or use a weapon with the STUN proc. So a club or mace is the best choice for a controlled situation, followed by the Niten proc Skyward Sword (which applies to 5 targets only).
Yes, I use a mace, and I use a Paradise when all mobs are stunned and do not end that stun within a 2 turn window. I do have a Devine Prof of 424 because of that, but a cloth prof of .. uhm... 60? I use that T3 spell for School Girls mostly - before a bash with skill I to III or OFC. Made the most sense to me. But still Imperil > T3.

All level-assigned Exquisites are trash. Some very low level Exquisite leather/melee weapons could be saved just to send to a freeshop, but they're still worth nothing.

1. Cast Speed
You do not have a Cast Speed Bonus, because you do not wear cloth. So you stick for a full 1.6 turns waving with your arms to actually get that spell cast. Since the HV minigame has the flaw advantage, that your damage is done first, then the (remaining) mobs are allowed to whack you within that 1.6 turn window. We are talking about a portion of difficulty, right? PFUDOR maybe? So the monsters have decent speed and that 1.6 window expands to 2+ turns.

Conclusion: A T3 spell is something to do, when the battlefield can be controlled by the the skills, procs and spells you have at your disposal. I would not recommend changing weapons for this single T3 cast. You need a turn window of 1.6 turns, so you have to use FUS (which is silly, because you drop 10% DPS) or use a weapon with the STUN proc. So a club or mace is the best choice for a controlled situation, followed by the Niten proc Skyward Sword (which applies to 5 targets only).

Or if the player is 1h, they can ignore incoming damage completely if their level is high enough. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

Yeah, the damage is minimal. So the question would be, is the proc worth it? I don't think so, mainly because it only lasts a few turns. Heavy armor users especially won't be able to get more than a few hits in with the proc active, right? As for the mitigation reduction... it'll increase strike damage by a tiny bit, but probably not enough to justify taking the time to cast T3 (when the alternative is to just continue hoverplaying all monsters to death).

This post has been edited by Superlatanium: Feb 10 2016, 03:01

Or if the player is 1h, they can ignore incoming damage completely if their level is high enough. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

Then you would surely cast no T3 Spell, because you have high mana costs and almost no MAcc, which makes casting damage spells a doubtful thing for 1h (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) But therefore you need no Imperil, that's build-in in any Rapier. ^^

Ha hah, reforging my power leggings cost me 3 amnesia shards but it finally gained me jugg!

Ha hah, reforging my power leggings cost me 3 amnesia shards but it finally gained me jugg!

Lucky you, I need some of that IW luck too:

8 Amnesias to get Overpower 1 for my Wakizashi, not to mention the 10 Amnesias I used to get it from potency tier 10 to 0 before and the ~15 I used to get Fatality+Overpower start in the beginning (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/faint.gif)

How on Earth am I going to get Overpower 5 on it ever. This "cheap" Bazaar find is becoming more expensive all the time. The Salvage right above Reforge in The Forge tab is becoming more and more tempting every time...

it is advisable to play PFUDOR for more legendary and Perless or should I keep playing IWBTH

es recomendable jugar en PFUDOR para obtener mas legendarios y perless o debo seguir jugando en IWBTH

it is advisable to play PFUDOR for more legendary and Perless or should I keep playing IWBTH

es recomendable jugar en PFUDOR para obtener mas legendarios y perless o debo seguir jugando en IWBTH

If you can handle incoming monster damage, yes. Better gear, better XP, better credits, better use of stamina.

I gotta say I prefer this arrangement a lot more, over the standard one.

Or if the player is 1h, they can ignore incoming damage completely if their level is high enough. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

Pretty much that was the idea (DW rapier + waki of nimble + light should be ok too).

So the question would be, is the proc worth it? I don't think so, mainly because it only lasts a few turns. Heavy armor users especially won't be able to get more than a few hits in with the proc active, right? As for the mitigation reduction... it'll increase strike damage by a tiny bit, but probably not enough to justify taking the time to cast T3 (when the alternative is to just continue hoverplaying all monsters to death).

I was thinking about the Hoverplay spell on new round, so all automatic, new round starts -> paradise lost -> normal attack to death.
Didn't consider the fact that the proc with Heavy Armor lasts only a few rounds so the utility is marginal, for a big mana cost.
Maybe it can work with hallowed rapier of slaughter + hallowed waki of nimble + all arcanist (less mana cost, slightly better damage, more rounds to make use of the proc), but that would be a very niche build.

After that check I need to check for "resist", because even 1 damn Token enables that on the monster side (a zero token on that monster perk line and the resist mechanics is disabled!), so again the whole thing for resist... So we end up (and I guess here) about 4 to 6 out of 10 get hit. With the 75% chance for the proc we end up with 3 to 4.5 out of 10 will show the migitation reduction.

Don't offensive spells have 3 separate rolls? (with no full 100% resist).
Are procs effected by resist rolls?
Wiki says nothing about this.

I gotta say I prefer this arrangement a lot more, over the standard one.

Normally I just exchange pos of monster pane and left pane so I can see the buff also (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

Normally I just exchange pos of monster pane and left pane so I can see the buff also (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

Feel free to share a picture of your arrangement.

How do I post up my equipment and stats to show, so that I could get some advice on dealing with monsters and getting more items/income?

Feel free to share a picture of your arrangement.

Just something like this

Pretty much that was the idea (DW rapier + waki of nimble + light should be ok too).
I was thinking about the Hoverplay spell on new round, so all automatic, new round starts -> paradise lost -> normal attack to death.
Didn't consider the fact that the proc with Heavy Armor lasts only a few rounds so the utility is marginal, for a big mana cost.
Maybe it can work with hallowed rapier of slaughter + hallowed waki of nimble + all arcanist (less mana cost, slightly better damage, more rounds to make use of the proc), but that would be a very niche build.
Don't offensive spells have 3 separate rolls? (with no full 100% resist).
Are procs effected by resist rolls?
Wiki says nothing about this.

The offensive spells work with the 3 rolls to determine how many dmg is inflicted with the steps 100%, 50%, 25%, 10%. The procs work different, like a Deprecating spell without evade (you already hit), which has the chance for a full resist and also only -1- roll. Burning Soul and Ripened Soul can be seen as exeption to this, because they actally do some dmg and need to be perked, but still they obey to the 0 1 rule: fully active or fully resisted. You just get no notification, that it was "resisted", working like the weapon procs, in which the Bleeding Wound is the exeption, because it deals dmg.

How do I post up my equipment and stats to show, so that I could get some advice on dealing with monsters and getting more items/income?

stats ~ just screenshot it than upload

Equipment ~ hover your mouse to that equip than press "C" on your keyboard

Pretty much that was the idea (DW rapier + waki of nimble + light should be ok too).

it's a style that has good potential, yep. also, it's quite easy to reach high values of evade/parry/resist even with slight forging.
if it only it had the chance to keep a perma-Spirit Stance like 1H (+1OC per parried hit would be enough) it would be a pretty badass style (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

How do I post up my equipment and stats to show, so that I could get some advice on dealing with monsters and getting more items/income?

hover the name of the gear with your mouse
press 'C' on your keybord
copy/paste the link from the popup that will appear. check your adblock settings if nothing shows up

This is my current equipment set. Is there any advice for me here?

Main Hand:
http://hentaiverse.org/pages/showequip.php...;key=faeb004216
Offhand:
http://hentaiverse.org/pages/showequip.php...;key=17591d9b8f
Helmet:
http://hentaiverse.org/pages/showequip.php...;key=934eeb4da7
Body:
http://hentaiverse.org/pages/showequip.php...;key=795ecf3e12
Hands:
http://hentaiverse.org/pages/showequip.php...;key=eee207a5b2
Legs:
http://hentaiverse.org/pages/showequip.php...;key=c695341faf
Feet:
http://hentaiverse.org/pages/showequip.php...;key=6081166c7a

I've been comparing various equipment in WTS.

Exactly how drastic a difference does 1 point of EDB make?

I keep finding Legendary Phase Caps with around 15 base EDB, which, according to the wiki, is in the lower end of that range.

Just something like this

I've got to admit your arrangement works better than what I thought. I'll adopt it too.

I've been comparing various equipment in WTS.

Exactly how drastic a difference does 1 point of EDB make?

I keep finding Legendary Phase Caps with around 15 base EDB, which, according to the wiki, is in the lower end of that range.

16/15 is 1.0667
So around 6.67% higher (cap) damage?
When you later hit the endgame on hentaiverse (does it exist?), that higher base value would be valuable.

Just something like this

I've got to admit your arrangement works better than what I thought. I'll adopt it too.

Would this be useful?

CODE

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(IMG:[my.mixtape.moe] https://my.mixtape.moe/svmoye.png)

This post has been edited by FabulousCupcake: Feb 10 2016, 13:06