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Asked the Experts, For archive purposes only. Please use Ask the Expert! for questions |
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Feb 6 2016, 05:14
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Superlatanium
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 7,631
Joined: 27-November 13

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I was thinking about Scavenger and monster slots. If HV's monster lab followed rules similar to other games, where more investment generally = more profit, then (what I initially was going to post): There's nothing all that special about "200 monsters" because the curve of gifts per chaos remains relatively smooth-ish, assuming each monster has a similar PL and win rate. By the time someone gets to 200 monsters, they'll be spending 250 tokens / 2 unlocked monsters = 125 tokens per 1 gift (per gift frequency). Scavenger increases the average number of gifts by +0.05 per level, so: (Last monster slot) 125 tokens for +1 gift = 6.25 tokens for +0.05 gifts (Scavenger 6) 6 tokens for +0.05 gifts (Scavenger 7) 7 tokens for +0.05 gifts
So by the time someone gets to 200 monsters, they'll already be upgrading Scavenger to 6 on each monster. Once unlocking additional slots stops being an option, it doesn't mean a whole lot in terms of your gifts per token rate; it goes from 1:100 - 1:120 (a number of times) -> 1:120 (198 times) -> 1:120 to 1:125 (a few times) to 1 : 140 (200 times) etc. The curve doesn't get much steeper at that point, it just gets very slightly more steep. But this is based on a false premise. The problem is that PL 25 monsters gather far, far more gifts than all other PLs, in my experience, at least until PL 950 or so. Each of my PL 25 monsters have been getting around 1 win a week, while my PL 200, 250, 300, 350 monsters get almost no wins ever (it looks like it's around one win every 2-3 months for each of those PLs). (I'd delete them if I could, but it's not allowed past 250) The other problem is that PL 25 monsters can only get one level of Scavenger, and raising their level even a little bit significantly lowers their gift rate, from what I've seen. Raising PL to get higher Scavenger and better materials is completely counterproductive, and despite more crystal and token investment, results in significantly fewer gifts (despite very slightly higher quality gifts). Very annoying that the zero-effort strategy is also the optimal strategy, as well as being the only real strategy for those without having millions of crystals to spare. Too bad. --- It's been said a few times that the base double gift chance is 0, which increases linearly to 100% as Scavenger goes from 0 to 20. But, my horde of PL 25 (Scavenger 1) monsters frequently bring me multiple gifts, and even sometimes 3 or 4 at once, even when there's almost no chance of a single one having gotten a couple of wins in such a short time period (less than an hour). I've seen this a few times, so either I'm seeing many extraordinarily unlikely events, or I'm interpreting something wrong, or the monster gifts code is different from what 10b has stated. Anyone know what might be going on?
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Feb 6 2016, 09:21
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dairyman20111889
Group: Members
Posts: 430
Joined: 27-April 09

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I think I'll be choosing Elec as my mage element.
Should I be after a Shocking Redwood Staff of the Elementalist, or a Shocking Willow Staff of Destruction?
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Feb 6 2016, 09:23
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nec1986
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 2,569
Joined: 12-October 14

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Idea should be more or less right, but dont forget higher pl means better materials. So even without wins it can be good enough to compensate completely. But im not sure about 3-4 at once. Maybe its lucky win+3days? QUOTE(dairyman20111889 @ Feb 6 2016, 10:21)  Shocking Willow Staff of Destruction?
Willow is significant better at pf, but usually it cost huge amount. This post has been edited by nec1986: Feb 6 2016, 09:25
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Feb 6 2016, 09:25
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DIEGOarnanta
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 325
Joined: 4-March 15

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QUOTE(dairyman20111889 @ Feb 6 2016, 09:21)  I think I'll be choosing Elec as my mage element.
Should I be after a Shocking Redwood Staff of the Elementalist, or a Shocking Willow Staff of Destruction?
willow have counter-resist
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Feb 7 2016, 02:27
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safmy
Group: Catgirl Camarilla
Posts: 690
Joined: 11-June 08

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Feb 7 2016, 02:58
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Cleavs
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 24,313
Joined: 18-January 07

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QUOTE(safmy @ Feb 7 2016, 01:27)  it depends on your element. Willow is a good option when we're speaking about Dark, Wind and Elec. for the others, clearly Oak should be better. apart for this, Willow can drop with Destruction suffix, while Oak only with Heimdall - not even Surtr or Niflehim - leaving it a valid choice only for Holy. last but not the least, Willow has native Deprecating prof, which is very useful for Imperil
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Feb 7 2016, 05:41
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Mewtty
Group: Members
Posts: 124
Joined: 17-January 10

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Hi experts,
I stopped playing in January 2015 and had a lot of potions. Now I have none. Where did they go? I can't heal myself outside of battle!
This post has been edited by Mewtty: Feb 7 2016, 05:41
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Feb 7 2016, 05:54
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nobody_xxx
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 13,753
Joined: 7-December 10

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QUOTE(Mewtty @ Feb 7 2016, 10:41)  Hi experts,
I stopped playing in January 2015 and had a lot of potions. Now I have none. Where did they go? I can't heal myself outside of battle!
gone , tenb remove them all (IMG:[ invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) you need to buy/get new healing items now ~ draught , potion and elixir (IMG:[ invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)
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Feb 7 2016, 06:02
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ChanForu
Group: Members
Posts: 204
Joined: 11-November 14

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Hey guys, is it just me or is no script working with Spark of Life alerting/channeling?
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Feb 7 2016, 06:52
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mozilla browser
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 2,131
Joined: 22-December 11

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QUOTE(Mewtty @ Feb 7 2016, 11:41)  Hi experts,
I stopped playing in January 2015 and had a lot of potions. Now I have none. Where did they go? I can't heal myself outside of battle!
Sent you an assortment of potions to get started. Don't forget to - raise your primary attributes - redistribute your ability points and put them into the slots - review the 0.82 and 0.83 release notes to see what else has changed. In particular, the fact that equipment is now level assigned. This post has been edited by mozilla browser: Feb 7 2016, 08:05
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Feb 7 2016, 09:40
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Void Domain
Group: Catgirl Camarilla
Posts: 2,131
Joined: 30-May 10

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QUOTE(ChanForu @ Feb 7 2016, 12:02)  Hey guys, is it just me or is no script working with Spark of Life alerting/channeling?
"hv stat slim mod" will alert on spark
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Feb 7 2016, 13:27
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Va4pfyPSd1gotEN05azB
Newcomer
 Group: Catgirl Camarilla
Posts: 41
Joined: 27-October 15

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I would like to know if I'm doing anything incorrectly for my playstyle, which is a cold mage. For example, does staff proficiency actually do anything? I would like to battle on higher difficulties since the EXP and rewards are better. I'd also like my rounds to be faster. Because after level ~250 or so, my damage feels like its been getting progressively worse. However, I've only been able to scrape by on my current difficulty by healing every other turn. In battle, I have Haste, Spark of Life, and Shadow Veil in IA and always have mana/health daughts, arcane focus, protection, and regen active. I have spell spam begin every round with casting fimbulveltr; then alternating blizzard and frost breath. I generally need to use several hits to take out an enemy. For red and above enemies, I use imperil since it's much faster that way; but since that's annoying, I generally don't do those arenas. For abilities, I pretty much have everything that I use maximized except spirit and spirit/health pots. For equipment, since I can't post urls in my first post, I basic have all exquisite niflheim phase robes (which I can't upgrade because of phazon is too expensive for me and I'm currently, slowly training adept learner to max) and an exquisite arctic redwood staff of elemental-ism. Stats: Additionally, how much better would another play style be?
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Feb 7 2016, 14:29
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Superlatanium
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 7,631
Joined: 27-November 13

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QUOTE(Va4pfyPSd1gotEN05azB @ Feb 7 2016, 11:27)  I would like to know if I'm doing anything incorrectly for my playstyle, which is a cold mage. For example, does staff proficiency actually do anything? Staff prof is nice. It adds MDB with the appropriate ability - it's like getting many levels of forging for free (when Bindings of Destruction otherwise cost 65k+ each). But the fact remains that you have to grind for staff prof separately, because mage playstyle never attacks with staff so you don't gain proficiency naturally like with everything else. Mage generally isn't recommended before 310 due to Imperil, firepower, and toughness problems, but you're close enough that it's easier to stick with it. Low-level mage will have to cure quite a lot on higher difficulties, especially without good equipment. Before ~310, I'd think that most should consider Nightmare or Hell the highest playable mage difficulty. (that's one of the reasons almost everyone continues to play melee for a while, since nearly any 1h melee can handle PF without much trouble past level 270 or so). Melee would let you play much higher difficulties, but turns per round would go way up. A decent mage should be able to clear most rounds in ~8 turns or less, preferably 6 or less without Imperil (lower difficulty). While 1h would be able to play on PF, it's also much slower - it might take 60 turns or something like that to kill everything on a 9-monster round. (With good / forged Power Slaughter that might go down to 40ish) If you like mage, if I were you, be satisfied with playing on lower difficulties until you get to 310. Then with 3-target 0-cooldown Imperil you can try Hell-Nintendo-IWBTH and see how things feel. (On high difficulty, you'd Imperil all monsters and then use damage spells.) If you're sticking with mage, it's not worth it to switch everything just for a handful of quick levels. Do raise Staff proficiency to near your level. It's time-consuming, but if you do it right it's very very easy. (crude IW + spellspam while watching anime for 5 hours) If you're not about to throw away your staff in the next few levels, forge its MDB to 5. It's cheap, doesn't require any special materials, and will have a relatively large effect on your clear speed. (Don't forge past 5 though, Bindings of Destruction cost too much) Use Spirit Shield as well if you don't already.
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Feb 7 2016, 14:31
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esam
Group: Members
Posts: 2,193
Joined: 23-January 16

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Hello dear people
I am keen to learn about MM. Based on what I read on WIKI, I can attach an item/equipment with a COD to be paid before the person can receive it. What I do not know is, if I want to purchase something from a thread, do I just attach the credits wanted for said item and send it then wait for a response with item attached without a COD?
So buying anything would become a trust trade, however selling something is not considering the COD taking place?
Not that I would have a problem with trust trades, just want to know how it goes before I venture into the buy/sell world.
Kind regards, Sam
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Feb 7 2016, 14:36
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Superlatanium
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 7,631
Joined: 27-November 13

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QUOTE(esam @ Feb 7 2016, 12:31)  I am keen to learn about MM. Based on what I read on WIKI, I can attach an item/equipment with a COD to be paid before the person can receive it. What I do not know is, if I want to purchase something from a thread, do I just attach the credits wanted for said item and send it then wait for a response with item attached without a COD?
So buying anything would become a trust trade, however selling something is not considering the COD taking place?
Not that I would have a problem with trust trades, just want to know how it goes before I venture into the buy/sell world. Either is fine. Either post and say say "Credits sent" (attach your credits in a MM; "trust trade") or say "COD please" (do nothing). I think there are one or two people that don't permit COD but they're very strange.
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Feb 7 2016, 14:43
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Fudo Masamune
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 1,636
Joined: 2-February 10

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QUOTE(Va4pfyPSd1gotEN05azB @ Feb 7 2016, 18:27) 
Additionally, how much better would another play style be?
provided you trained the proficiency to around 200-250, you should be able to do most non SG (last 3 arena) arenas on PFUDOR using 1h-heavy, even tough it's noticeably slower. and if my assumption is correct dual wield should be ok-ish, and 2h will be just as hard as maging. the main requirements to be able to do higher difficulty is the ability to stay alive after-all.
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Feb 7 2016, 14:50
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Superlatanium
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 7,631
Joined: 27-November 13

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QUOTE(Fudo Masamune @ Feb 7 2016, 12:43)  provided you trained the proficiency to around 200-250, you should be able to do most non SG (last 3 arena) arenas on PFUDOR using 1h-heavy, even tough it's noticeably slower. and if my assumption is correct dual wield should be ok-ish, and 2h will be just as hard as maging. "Possible to do", yes, but also very likely worse in terms of credits/turn and XP/turn. High difficulty SG arenas are junky except for those with great gear. I think the pertinent question is, on the standard arenas, "low tier mage on ~Hell" vs "low tier 1h on ~PF". I'm curious what the numbers would be. With high level and high-tier stats, mage > 1h, but it would be interesting to figure out at exactly which level the balance tips. This post has been edited by Superlatanium: Feb 7 2016, 14:53
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Feb 7 2016, 14:51
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esam
Group: Members
Posts: 2,193
Joined: 23-January 16

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QUOTE(Superlatanium @ Feb 7 2016, 13:36)  Either is fine. Either post and say say "Credits sent" (attach your credits in a MM; "trust trade") or say "COD please" (do nothing). I think there are one or two people that don't permit COD but they're very strange.
Wonderful! Being so new to the community I'll wait a couple months before I too go strange on you people...he he... Have a good day. <3
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Feb 7 2016, 14:52
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nec1986
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 2,569
Joined: 12-October 14

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I d advice mage mostly only after 400. In some cases its very good like sg, because its low income damage with aoe strong hits or low diff hellfest, because with good t/s its possibly to clear in hour without any problems. For that even 310 should be more or less ok, but pf arenas slightly different. I rerolled with 350-360+ level and 20-30m+ (spend solid amount for perks) and it wasnt very easy. Slightly faster, but also much harder. Maybe 1h mage can work good in this case until higher level.
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Feb 7 2016, 15:05
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Superlatanium
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 7,631
Joined: 27-November 13

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QUOTE(nec1986 @ Feb 7 2016, 12:52)  Slightly faster, but also much harder. What difficulties were you trying? PF would surely be tough for many levels, but I wonder about no-Imperil mage on low difficulty (Hard-Nightmare-Hell). If damage taken is low enough, it might be good for easy quick play, for those with stamina to burn and not a lot of time to dedicate to HV. It would require more concentration than 1h, but even with that I think credits/time would be far higher (2.5x? 3x?). (but of course there'd also be less XP gain. some care about XP, some don't)
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