[X] My Assistant

but I think mages need to be ahead a little for all the time they're at the mercy of such ridiculous requirements in terms of matching prefixes/suffixes.

I dont have a problem with mage been the best. But the difference to all other styles is imo just a bad joke. a whole PFest in under an hour and such. I just dont have any words for that.

I think Uncle Stu's defensive power setup is probably the most cost-efficient way to do so

Well doing fest all right from the beginning the reason for my defensive set. But it is not the most time-efficient way. I mean around three hours for a whole PFest for me. And it took me quite some forging to be even able to do PFest, but otherhwise i dont use SoL, so i guess it could be possible that i would have been able to do them much sooner.

I also think melee should be buffed, but what would be a good way to buff it? Should we just give it better attack so it can two shot SG, or perhaps reduce the cooldown and OC cost of OFC?

Honestly it's bullshit that melee clear time is triple of that of mage, and that should be fixed. But I'm quite curious what kind of buff could fix them reasonably without going complete broken hmm...

Yeah, that is the question. Actually, the first i would take a look at is the Overcharge of DW, 2H and Niten. Make it somehow easier for them to maintain it. You know? Like 1H. Make it easier to stay most of the time in spirit stance. No big difference of course. But that is where i would start. But no i would let the OFC how it is. I mean the OFC is nice, sure as sure, but i still want to play 1H and not OFC Mage.

Yes, true. The first impression of mage I got was it uses weaker OFC every turn, but maybe I got it the other way around - OFC is melee's way of experiencing how mage feels like every 50 turns (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

That being said, I completely agree with you on how we should maintain the identity of melee characters.
One idea I have is this: Rework RoB or make new contents that feature rounds with small number of stronger enemies, maybe like three.
Where 1H thrives with its firepower on single enemy and mage can't do as good since it's more focused on AoE. RoB is in my opinion intended to feature that but it's too insignificant and not accessible compared to grindfest.

Then again, I've only played 1H besides mage so I can't come up with good solutions for other styles, but I think it'd be cool to have contents where each style excels in. But arena should def get a fix or other styles should get buffed so that they would be able to do it as good as mage, cuz it's the most common and important part of HV. It's just unfair the way it is now.

"mage should be better than others cuz it's more expensive' might be true realistically, but it's more like they became that expensive cuz they're so superior lol. Even if we can't get them to get on completely equal footing, gap should def close a bit.

This post has been edited by Saioux: Mar 14 2019, 03:51

I also think melee should be buffed, but what would be a good way to buff it? Should we just give it better attack so it can two shot SG, or perhaps reduce the cooldown and OC cost of OFC?

Honestly it's bullshit that melee clear time is triple of that of mage, and that should be fixed. But I'm quite curious what kind of buff could fix them reasonably without going complete broken hmm...

I've posted it twice but it's always good to repeat (there is always hope that Tenboro will accept the idea (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) ).

I think just increasing the ADB by increasing the limits of the abilities. And the increase should be higher for 2H, slightly down for DW, and average for 1H.

Today it is like this:
1H (+40 per ten points of proficiency)
2H (+30 per ten points of proficiency)
DW (+50 per ten points of proficiency)

It should be something like:
1H (+80 per ten points of proficiency)
2H (+120 per ten points of proficiency)
DW (+100 per ten points of proficiency)

My idea is basically to compensate for the lack of defense with brute force. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif)

But even so all melee styles will continue slower than mages, for the simple fact that we can not hit all the monsters at the same time.

"mage should be better than others cuz it's more expensive' might be true realistically, but it's more like they became that expensive cuz they're so superior lol.

Well, that is one site of the truth. But good equipment is also rare. I mean for 1H a rapier only had to be slaughter and have some damage and you are golden. But a staff? I mean ethereal weapon are overrated, but an ethereal staff is just HGW, while a ethereal rapier isnt worthless.

Damage could be straight up doubled across the board and I think it still wouldn't compete with mage for clear speed (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

I think survivability needs to be addressed for DW in particular. I'd say 2H too, but sickentide just blew my mind with the mace pfest clear - I guess those domino strike stuns have a huge effect.

I think evade chance should be ramped, because it is basically none existent again PL monster above round 100, and I think DW and 2H will gain more with this than with ramped damage. Although mages could benefit from this too, I don't think they would feel any difference as they'll breeze through any round either way. But I don't know what should be ramped for heavy meele style.

This post has been edited by fuadhika: Mar 14 2019, 04:29

Well, that is one site of the truth. But good equipment is also rare. I mean for 1H a rapier only had to be slaughter and have some damage and you are golden. But a staff? I mean ethereal weapon are overrated, but an ethereal staff is just HGW, while a ethereal rapier isnt worthless.

If you think about it, these are your options for 1H:
(Disregarding quality)
7 elemental prefixes.

Ethereal, Fiery, Arctic, Shocking, Tempestuous, Hallowed, Demonic

All basically viable.

Axe has 4 suffixes,
Club has 7 suffixes,
Shortsword 7 as well,
Wakizashi 5,
Rapier 7 suffixes,
Only rapier of slaughter is viable for a good 1H/heavy setup.

So basically, for 1H. There are 210 possible drops (not counting quality) only 7 of which are considered good.


For staff you have:
7 elementer prefixes, only Ethereal is useless.
Fiery is not as sought after, so let's say 5 are viable (3 elemental and dark+holy).

Oak staff has 3 suffixes,
Katalox staff has 6 suffixes,
Willow staff has 3 suffixes,
Redwood staff has 7 suffixes,

The viable ones are:
Dark Katalox of destruction
Holy Oak of Heimdall
elemental redwood/willow of destruction

So basically, for mage. There are 133 possible drops (not counting quality), 8 of which are considered good.


7 out of 210
8 out of 133

You'd think rapiers would be more expensive?

If you think about it, these are your options for 1H:
(Disregarding quality)
7 elemental prefixes.

All basically viable.

Axe has 4 suffixes,
Club has 7 suffixes,
Shortsword 7 as well,
Wakizashi 5,
Rapier 7 suffixes,
Only rapier of slaughter is viable for a good 1H/heavy setup.

So basically, for 1H. There are 210 possible drops (not counting quality) only 7 of which are considered good.
For staff you have:
7 elementer prefixes, only Ethereal is useless.
Fiery is not as sought after, so let's say 5 are viable (3 elemental and dark+holy).

Oak staff has 3 suffixes,
Katalox staff has 6 suffixes,
Willow staff has 3 suffixes,
Redwood staff has 7 suffixes,

The viable ones are:
Dark Katalox of destruction
Holy Oak of Heimdall
elemental redwood/willow of destruction

So basically, for mage. There are 133 possible drops (not counting quality), 8 of which are considered good.
7 out of 210
8 out of 133

You'd think rapiers would be more expensive?

Maybe what affecting the price is the demand? I mean there's way more player that want to play mage at end game than to play 1H. It is almost like mandatory to be a mage at end game. Not to mention the advantages of being mage, so it makes sense that even though the probability of mage drop is better than 1H, the price will still be higher.

Maybe what affecting the price is the demand? I mean there's way more player that want to play mage at end game than to play 1H. It is almost like mandatory to be a mage at end game. Not to mention the advantages of being mage, so it makes sense that even though the probability of mage drop is better than 1H, the price will still be higher.

I guess?
Still, there's quite a few 90+ ADB rapiers around....

I guess part of it is that for rapier ADB and parry are the 2 important stats
Whereas for staff it's MDB and EDB and prof
So a higher likelihood to get 2 good rolls for a great rapier than 3 good rolls for a great staff.

Don't 1H weapons drop 3x as often as staves? Plus Waki's are more rare than rapiers no?

What about IWFest? It's not like the drops greatly different from PFFest right?

Just finished iwfest.

Club of slaughter + rapier of the nimble
21782 turns; 02:15:06
Spark of life: 3; cure: 71; Full cure 9; Health gem 28

It blasts me how everyone asks for a melee buff and says that mage is oP, while no one actually forges a melee set tp the brim to unlock its true potential.
Compare things that can be compared, would you?

This post has been edited by decondelite: Mar 14 2019, 09:04

It blasts me how everyone asks for a melee buff and says that mage is oP, while no one actually forges a melee set tp the brim to unlock its true potential.
Compare things that can be compared, would you?

I understand what you're saying, but with or without unlocking it's 'true potential', you can easily calculate and compare the two.

Seriously, someone give me a fully forged melee set that is forged A) to "the brim" and B ) "unlock its true potential" and compare it's speed in clearing some arenas. Actually, a more fun experiment is: flat out double the damage potential of all melee weapons and see how close it compares to mage clear speed. I understand clear speed is not the only metric usefulness of a class can be measured by, but it's by far a very clear and well understood metric for most users here.

Not that any of this matters to me, I barely play the game anymore (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

This post has been edited by aleden: Mar 14 2019, 09:11

It blasts me how everyone asks for a melee buff and says that mage is oP, while no one actually forges a melee set tp the brim to unlock its true potential.
Compare things that can be compared, would you?

If you buy all the bindings, Slaughterx100@100kx7=70m, while mages have to spend roughly the same if not less, if they have a couple of radiant pieces (phazons). The cost of max upgrading is just so much that it's not worth it when mage is just... well, better.

I'm estimating here, obviously.

Also the fact that shade is missing piercing mitigation hurts it a lot, so it's not something that can be waved off as just not forging enough. I don't know enough about 1H to make any assumptions on that, but anything+shade is clearly in a bad spot right now.

Just finished iwfest.

Club of slaughter + rapier of the nimble
21782 turns; 02:15:06
Spark of life: 3; cure: 71; Full cure 9; Health gem 28

Was it a breezy or a toughie?

-snip-

Calculate? What for? You can calculate and spout all the numbers you want all day, it will neither prove nor validate anything as long as you don't actually try and experiment.
I will acknwoledge only someone who actually tried, played it to confirm that it sucks. Everyone else can pretty much GTFO, no offense intended.

I have already proven once how wrong the general assumption can be with my 1H playstyle. It shows pretty much how misleading and fucked up all the maths/theory can be. I wouldn't be surprised that 2H is actually way better than how everyone assumes it to be, if you do use a proper setup and playstyle. Given it's played seriously by someone who actually wants to dig out its potential.

• 1H drops 3x more often than staffs
• top level wakizashi or non-slaughter can occasionally fetch decent prices
• prefixes and suffixes are not all equally rare
• on high level 1H arguably parry is extraneous, crit and PA matter more

In particular the slaughter suffix is fairly common on 1H weapons but is very rare on power armor. That's the main reason slaughter armor of comparable quality costs more.

Calculate? What for? You can calculate and spout all the numbers you want all day, it will neither prove nor validate anything as long as you don't actually try and experiment.
I will acknwoledge only someone who actually tried, played it to confirm that it sucks. Everyone else can pretty much GTFO, no offense intended.

I have already proven once how wrong the general assumption can be with my 1H playstyle. It shows pretty much how misleading and fucked up all the maths/theory can be. I wouldn't be surprised that 2H is actually way better than how everyone assumes it to be, if you do use a proper setup and playstyle. Given it's played seriously by someone who actually wants to dig out its potential.

Haven't lololo16 and lestion dug deep enough to DW style? And they both can't complete PFFest, I don't know about you but to me that's saying something.

This post has been edited by fuadhika: Mar 14 2019, 09:56