[X] My Assistant

Depends on purposes? For straight damage, it's full savage shadowdancer, but if you were going for pffest I think it would be excusable to use piece or two of negation for the resist chance. It's even less one-size-fits-all than 1H+heavy, since surviving pffest is so difficult for light armour users. Actually, I just wiped somewhere in the 900s in an iwbth fest... (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/anime_cry.gif)

It's hard to get data on this cause there's pretty much zero endgame DW players, at least of those who do it as their main style. Damage is fine (can feel a little behind in some situations, but frenzied blows is undeniably excellent for single target or small groups) but surviving is not very good.

Just how many millions do I need to bleed to get a good set of savage shadowdancer. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)
Negation? Not fleet for maximum evade?

Just how many millions do I need to bleed to get a good set of savage shadowdancer. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)
Negation? Not fleet for maximum evade?

Oh, dont worry. Shade is usually cheaper as power armor or mage equipment. And iirc shadowdancer and fleet have the same evade bonus.

Just how many millions do I need to bleed to get a good set of savage shadowdancer. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)
Negation? Not fleet for maximum evade?

Less than good power armor would cost, and maybe a single digit percentage of what high tier cloth would be... (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) Forging it is a damn sight cheaper on the most part, too.

The problem is shadowdancer is a fairly rare drop, and savage even moreso. I've rarely ever even seen any for sale, letalone good pieces.

I really wouldn't recommend investing that heavily into DW either. Maybe if you're a hath baron or deep pocket donor, but if you're a self-sustaining player and you ever want to clear things FAST or farm pfests, plan to swap to mage or 1h/shield one day.

Also Uncle is right about fleet vs shadowdancer, afaik, and the wiki corroborates this also

This post has been edited by lestion: Mar 13 2019, 18:16

Just how many millions do I need to bleed to get a good set of savage shadowdancer. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)
Negation? Not fleet for maximum evade?

I spent 17m on my stuff but overpaid for some pieces, maybe 10~12m could be enough. However, lestion is right, they aren't that common

Oh, dont worry. Shade is usually cheaper as power armor or mage equipment. And iirc shadowdancer and fleet have the same evade bonus.

Now that you said it, indeed power and mage armors are a lot expensive, I guess that's the silver lining of playing DW. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
Hoho, so I'd better off investing on shadowdancer eventhough it's pricier after all, it's just painfully hard to find good magnificent shadowdancer for my level use right now (I'm more or less have a good enough full set end game elemental shadowdancer ready).

The problem is shadowdancer is a fairly rare drop, and savage even moreso. I've rarely ever even seen any for sale, letalone good pieces.

I really wouldn't recommend investing that heavily into DW either. Maybe if you're a hath baron or deep pocket donor, but if you're a self-sustaining player and you ever want to clear things FAST or farm pfests, plan to swap to mage or 1h/shield one day.

Yeah, so far I've only found and bought 2 pieces of savage shadowdancer, but 1 with crap adb and the other with crap stats overall, gdi, I think I'd better off with my elemental shadowdancers.
Hmm, I think I'll try 1H later after I complete my DW set, but not the usual 1H, I'm interested to try 1H with shade armor set and buckler barrier, so not only I'll get block and parry, I also can evade. How feasible is that?

I spent 17m on my stuff but overpaid for some pieces, maybe 10~12m could be enough. However, lestion is right, they aren't that common

Hopefully you're right on that price range, currently have around 11m and I'm more or less already have good weapons, just need to wait good armor pieces to pop up on auction (can't really find any on WTS shops after all). Is your set full savage shadowdancer or mixed? Edit: oh you show it on your signature (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) didn't realize it.

This post has been edited by fuadhika: Mar 13 2019, 22:22

Now that you said it, indeed power and mage armors are a lot expensive, I guess that's the silver lining of playing DW. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
Hoho, so I'd better off investing on shadowdancer eventhough it's pricier after all, it's just painfully hard to find good magnificent shadowdancer for my level use right now (I'm more or less have a good enough full set end game elemental shadowdancer ready).
Yeah, so far I've only found and bought 2 pieces of savage shadowdancer, but 1 with crap adb and the other with crap stats overall, gdi, I think I'd better off with my elemental shadowdancers.
Hmm, I think I'll try 1H later after I complete my DW set, but not the usual 1H, I'm interested to try 1H with shade armor set and buckler barrier, so not only I'll get block and parry, I also can evade. How feasible is that?

In my experience, mag shadowdancer is going to be worse than passable leg fleet/negation for most situations. You might lose up to 1k turns on DWD if your weapons are really good, but survivability is going to be more important for general purpose play anyway. You should be able to find some pretty high adb leg fleet fairly cheap and that'll make up a bit of the difference of not having the crit. Savage fleet/negation even better (but probably wouldn't spend more than 1mil on a piece).

1h with light armor? Someone might be able to clarify depending on the order this happens in, but to my understanding: that would severely hamper your damage. Can't counter-attack if you evade, and the much much lower burden will allow you to have much higher attack speed, which will also work against you...

What difficulty are you on right now, btw? I went into pf around 350, but I really really noticed a lot of slowdown after 400. That's part of why I would recommend not committing too hard to the more awkward playstyles... things are a lot less fun when they're a ton slower and taking more effort to stay alive (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

This post has been edited by lestion: Mar 13 2019, 22:50

I. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) -> 1H

lololo16 -> DW and Niten
Drksrpnt -> DW
t_t_z -> 1H
blackjac00 -> 1H
Waifu Maniac -> 1H

We are few, but we exist. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

your list seems suspiciously devoid of 2H players, just sayin (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif)

your list seems suspiciously devoid of 2H players, just sayin (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif)

I forgot that "detail". (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif) Sorry. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/blush.gif)

DW is bad for PFFest. Full stop. Even with agile shadowdancer, you just get too much damage taken so you have to cure all the time. Unless you do some weird shit with FRD or something, it's just not worth it.

In my experience, mag shadowdancer is going to be worse than passable leg fleet/negation for most situations. You might lose up to 1k turns on DWD if your weapons are really good, but survivability is going to be more important for general purpose play anyway. You should be able to find some pretty high adb leg fleet fairly cheap and that'll make up a bit of the difference of not having the crit. Savage fleet/negation even better (but probably wouldn't spend more than 1mil on a piece).

1h with light armor? Someone might be able to clarify depending on the order this happens in, but to my understanding: that would severely hamper your damage. Can't counter-attack if you evade, and the much much lower burden will allow you to have much higher attack speed, which will also work against you...

What difficulty are you on right now, btw? I went into pf around 350, but I really really noticed a lot of slowdown after 400. That's part of why I would recommend not committing too hard to the more awkward playstyles... things are a lot less fun when they're a ton slower and taking more effort to stay alive (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

Damn, really don't feel like spending around 1m on temporary armors (planning to soulfuse all my leg ele shadow by the time I reach 400). But I guess leg fleet would be cheap enough to be temporary armor for my level now, thanks for the advice.
Ah yeah I forgot about 1H counter, so I guess light 1H would be exclusive for survival? With way much slower play than normal 1H.
I am breezing through arenas on PF right now, been doing this since around later 200 or early 300 iirc. But on IW last time I play I did it on IWBTH, not tried PF yet though so not sure whether able to do it or not.

DW is bad for PFFest. Full stop. Even with agile shadowdancer, you just get too much damage taken so you have to cure all the time. Unless you do some weird shit with FRD or something, it's just not worth it.

What about IWFest? It's not like the drops greatly different from PFFest right?

This post has been edited by fuadhika: Mar 14 2019, 00:47

What about IWFest? It's not like the drops greatly different from PFFest right?

Well, i am no expert for DW, but i am quite sure if you want to do some Fest, DW is imo not the best choice.

Well, i am no expert for DW, but i am quite sure if you want to do some Fest, DW is imo not the best choice.

So it's either 1H or mage only? Damn, other style should get an update then. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/anime_cry.gif)

So it's either 1H or mage only? Damn, other style should get an update then. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/anime_cry.gif)

Well, actually i would say all melee styles could need a little more love from 10bo. But you dont need to do Fest. Iirc you just play until 80 stamina right? So there is still quite some improvement to do. I mean DW can be faster doing the arenas, so i think you should just try it out.

Well, actually i would say all melee styles could need a little more love from 10bo. But you dont need to do Fest. Iirc you just play until 80 stamina right? So there is still quite some improvement to do. I mean DW can be faster doing the arenas, so i think you should just try it out.

We could certainly all do with a damage buff to get even remotely close to mage... it'd honestly benefit the market greatly to equalize prices a bit, but I think mages need to be ahead a little for all the time they're at the mercy of such ridiculous requirements in terms of matching prefixes/suffixes. The staff market is kinda silly compared to every other piece of equipment, even (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

DW's damage is probably a little better than 1H in ideal gear, and definitely a ton better against low target fights, but I'm not really sure what could be changed about it (and 2H) to bring up the survivability in a way that doesn't accidentally make power armor obsolete or something

What about IWFest? It's not like the drops greatly different from PFFest right?

I did IFest earlier today. My stats are availabile in the DWD thread. It started getting tough in the 700s and I died around 920. The additional capabilities of PFUDOR monsters probably would've slaughtered me before getting to 600, maybe even 500.

Edit: I want to note that, by my understanding, PFest is by no means easy for the other styles either, the investment required is through the roof. If you aren't selling gold stars, running a (powerful) H@H client, or even completing bounties, it's likely to take a very, very long time to be capable of doing fests anyway. I think Uncle Stu's defensive power setup is probably the most cost-efficient way to do so

This post has been edited by lestion: Mar 14 2019, 02:33

The only time I tried pffest (yesterday) with DW I reached round 500 without sparking (cured like 10 times) and took me 70 minutes. Maybe I'll try iwfest later...

If you aren't selling gold stars, running a (powerful) H@H client, or even completing bounties, it's likely to take a very, very long time to be capable of doing fests anyway.

it doesn't take all that much if you're willing to use a mace with a shade set, which is what i used for my first PFfest clear

but I think mages need to be ahead a little for all the time they're at the mercy of such ridiculous requirements in terms of matching prefixes/suffixes.

I dont have a problem with mage been the best. But the difference to all other styles is imo just a bad joke. a whole PFest in under an hour and such. I just dont have any words for that.

I think Uncle Stu's defensive power setup is probably the most cost-efficient way to do so

Well doing fest all right from the beginning the reason for my defensive set. But it is not the most time-efficient way. I mean around three hours for a whole PFest for me. And it took me quite some forging to be even able to do PFest, but otherhwise i dont use SoL, so i guess it could be possible that i would have been able to do them much sooner.

I also think melee should be buffed, but what would be a good way to buff it? Should we just give it better attack so it can two shot SG, or perhaps reduce the cooldown and OC cost of OFC?

Honestly it's bullshit that melee clear time is triple of that of mage, and that should be fixed. But I'm quite curious what kind of buff could fix them reasonably without going complete broken hmm...

Yeah, that is the question. Actually, the first i would take a look at is the Overcharge of DW, 2H and Niten. Make it somehow easier for them to maintain it. You know? Like 1H. Make it easier to stay most of the time in spirit stance. No big difference of course. But that is where i would start. But no i would let the OFC how it is. I mean the OFC is nice, sure as sure, but i still want to play 1H and not OFC Mage.

Yes, true. The first impression of mage I got was it uses weaker OFC every turn, but maybe I got it the other way around - OFC is melee's way of experiencing how mage feels like every 50 turns (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

That being said, I completely agree with you on how we should maintain the identity of melee characters.
One idea I have is this: Rework RoB or make new contents that feature rounds with small number of stronger enemies, maybe like three.
Where 1H thrives with its firepower on single enemy and mage can't do as good since it's more focused on AoE. RoB is in my opinion intended to feature that but it's too insignificant and not accessible compared to grindfest.

Then again, I've only played 1H besides mage so I can't come up with good solutions for other styles, but I think it'd be cool to have contents where each style excels in. But arena should def get a fix or other styles should get buffed so that they would be able to do it as good as mage, cuz it's the most common and important part of HV. It's just unfair the way it is now.

"mage should be better than others cuz it's more expensive' might be true realistically, but it's more like they became that expensive cuz they're so superior lol. Even if we can't get them to get on completely equal footing, gap should def close a bit.

This post has been edited by Saioux: Mar 14 2019, 03:51