[X] My Assistant

I heard that it suitable for Niten.
Btw, how Shortsword of Slaughter compare to Rapier of Slaughter? Anyone with experience could tell me the clear speed of Shortsword?

I don't know about the clearspeed but:

Shortsword has higher ADB than Rapier. HOWEVER,
Rapier gives the "Penetrated Armor" proc, which increases your damage a lot when it hits.
I feel that for DW, Rapier is still best, but since you kill things fairly quickly anyway, Shortsword might be similar in clear speed to Rapier for most content.

I do think that Rapier is still king for schoolgirl arenas though, again due to the penetrated armor debuff.

I heard that it suitable for Niten.
Btw, how Shortsword of Slaughter compare to Rapier of Slaughter? Anyone with experience could tell me the clear speed of Shortsword?

For starters, Shortsword is clearly to be played with Imperil, in all cases, since it cannot deal with PMit on its own. That is not an option, unless you're under Lvl310. So if you're allergic to spamming Imperil in every round, forget about it.
Imp Shortsword is definitely the quickest way to kill Schoolgirls and FSM, a few players did confirm that lately. So if you prefer a Rapier for the regular gameplay, it's at least recommended to have a Hallowed/Demonic Shortsword for the SG arenas and FSM.

For regular monsters, Imp Shortsword will give roughly the same result as Imp Rapier, while non-Imp Rapier will be slower (but certainly the easiest to handle). If your Depr prof factor is sky high and if you have enough attack power, Imp Shortsword is the fastest, since it has higher damage output and you will barely be slown down by monsters PMit.

TL;DR
It does can do wonders, but it takes a lot of effort to draw out its true potential.

For starters, Shortsword is clearly to be played with Imperil, in all cases, since it cannot deal with PMit on its own. That is not an option, unless you're under Lvl310. So if you're allergic to spamming Imperil in every round, forget about it.
Imp Shortsword is definitely the quickest way to kill Schoolgirls and FSM, a few players did confirm that lately. So if you prefer a Rapier for the regular gameplay, it's at least recommended to have a Hallowed/Demonic Shortsword for the SG arenas and FSM.

For regular monsters, Imp Shortsword will give roughly the same result as Imp Rapier, while non-Imp Rapier will be slower (but certainly the easiest to handle). If your Depr prof factor is sky high and if you have enough attack power, Imp Shortsword is the fastest, since it has higher damage output and you will barely be slown down by monsters PMit.

TL;DR
It does can do wonders, but it takes a lot of effort to draw out its true potential.

My Depr prof is 297, for my level is high enough?
I pick this Legendary Fiery Shortsword of Slaughter (313) in Barzaar, even though is not Hallowed/Demonic Shortsword, but is still do the job, right?

Having a base Prof>110%*level is a very good start, yes. Ideally you'd also have the Evil Enchantress perk, but it's less important.
Can't say anything about the sword right now, I don't have ranges available on mobile.

I kinda play on and off the game with months in between, ex: last time I soulfused this: Exquisite Ethereal Shortsword of Balance and it cost around 30?

Anyway, DW with the above as main and this Magnificent Wakizashi of the Nimble as offhand.

Armor is average shade except for leather breastplate.

Highest difficulty I can do on random encounter is nintendo.

DW, light, depr and supp profs are around 220.

str-228
dex-218
agi-218
end-228
int-146
wis-169

advice pls?

also what should I do with these:
precursor artifact
robo rabbit head
stocking stuffers
mysterious tooth
delicate flower
mithra's flower
dalek voicebox

I kinda play on and off the game with months in between, ex: last time I soulfused this: Exquisite Ethereal Shortsword of Balance and it cost around 30?

Anyway, DW with the above as main and this Magnificent Wakizashi of the Nimble as offhand.

Armor is average shade except for leather breastplate.

Highest difficulty I can do on random encounter is nintendo.

DW, light, depr and supp profs are around 220.

str-228
dex-218
agi-218
end-228
int-146
wis-169

advice pls?

Get a better (but still cheap) main hand weapon (Slaughter suffix, Mag+, 3 PABS).
If you can get someone to IW them for you (whatever free IW, since you'll change them again around 250 more or less, and targeted IW is a cost not justified below good Leg.)
At least for the main hand, forge at least the PABS and ADB up to 5, DEX/END a bit more)

also what should I do with these:
precursor artifact
robo rabbit head
stocking stuffers
mysterious tooth
delicate flower
mithra's flower
dalek voicebox

precursor artifact : current WTB prices around 18 k each; at such price, I usually prefer to shrine them (for attriibutes points and EDs) rather then sell, but it's your choice

collections or shrine for (mostly unlucky to awful) equip drops, or SELL.

robo rabbit head : around 50k to 100k (if lucky) at last auctions
stocking stuffers : usually around 100 to 150 k
mysterious tooth & delicate flower: see last auctions, price varies a lot (usually between 500k and 1 M)
mithra's flower & dalek voicebox : around 700 C each, or you can shrine for equips (but is improbable to get anything worthwhile; still, you can then salvage the equipment for scraps or bazaar it)

My Depr prof is 297, for my level is high enough?

take note that you aren't merely consider the depre proficiency to counter the resist, but you have to consider your magic accuracy too for the evade.
imperil play maybe works, but imperiling on melee is a fkin chore.
imperiling 3 GF/round is still bearable, but all enemies per round using vanilla equipment with sub 100% m.accuracy? yeah lol, good luck with that.

also what should I do with these:
precursor artifact

either sell to wtb or shrine hoping for ED

robo rabbit head
stocking stuffers
mysterious tooth
delicate flower

you could try to auction it, robo head and stocking wouldn't sell for much (maybe ~100k) but the other 2 are pretty expensive I believe (2-4 weeks ago those sold for 600-800k in auction). if you don't like the number or expecting more, the other option is open wts and slap higher price.

mithra's flower
dalek voicebox

either sell it on wtb or shrine it if you feel lucky (most of the time you aren't as lucky as you think.)

This post has been edited by Fudo Masamune: Sep 3 2019, 15:12

Yes, I haven't mentioned that investing points in WIS and Aether Shards are necessary for that. That Arcanist shade is of a great help at it too. But I didn't want to explain in detail how to max out the success rate of Imperil.

However, saying that casting Imperil 3 times a round is a bother is only a personal opinion as well as a matter of habit/proper preparation. I couldn't stand being slow as hell with a non-Imp Rapier gameplay, for my part, while the 3 casts of Imperil is done almost mindlessly within a single second.

This post has been edited by decondelite: Sep 3 2019, 15:59

Btw, how Shortsword of Slaughter compare to Rapier of Slaughter? Anyone with experience could tell me the clear speed of Shortsword?

I posted this some time ago: https://forums.e-hentai.org/index.php?s=&am...t&p=5464615

Read the following posts and draw your conclusions.

Note: When I did this test, my Rapier had upgrade lv.50 for ADB (today is 100), and all Power Slaughter equipment had 25 levels in all attributes (today everything is 50).

I said nothing last time in order not to make you look like an idiot and because I don't want to start arguments/a fuss, but it looks like you're somehow forcing me to do it/begging for it.

You don't even understand the very basics of that playstyle, and you dare using that joke of a test as a reference and giving lessons? You basically did everything wrong, so it could only fail. For starters, you had terrible success rate to land Imperil and were leaving a lot of monsters unaffected. Second, you utterly ruined the only advantage the Shortsword has by using Power of Slaughter besides the weapon. And third, you weren't making use of the counterattacks properly, while the style revolves around dealing a maximal damage output out of these while leaving the main attack to deal with unaffected monsters. Which of course means tanking as many as possible at once, for as long as possible, thus suggests Power of Protection+Warding even more.

I have nothing against you, but next time you perform an experiment, I suggest that you first get a good grasp/proper understanding of what you're studying.

No hard feelings. Cheers.

I said nothing last time in order not to make you look like an idiot and because I don't want to start arguments/a fuss, but it looks like you're somehow forcing me to do it/begging for it.
---
No hard feelings. Cheers.

I have nothing against you, but next time you said something, I suggest that you first get a good grasp/proper understanding of what you're trying to say.
Choose whether you're trying to insult somebody or trying to look polite, since apparently you fail at both of them.

Also, even if what basara presented is faulty, you're no better than him by sharing partial information just to push your shortsword religion, and only disclose the worst part of it when somebody else mention the fault.

imperil for melee is fkin chore, and it's not personal preference, it's a fact that it take a lot to make it not being evaded and resisted more than half of the time.
you mention it's almost mindless in less than a second, but once again, you fail to mention the fact that those second doesn't warrant a full imperil stick
3 cast per round is easy, make those imperil stick on the monsters is a different question
only when basara link his result that you mention that without extra care imperil on melee have terrible success rate and call him not knowing what he's doing for not doing the extra care.

oh god, this is exactly the same as what vincento said a few days ago, no wonder I feel the deja vu.

oh god, this is exactly the same as what vincento said a few days ago, no wonder I feel the deja vu.

Yeah, that is something he does quite often. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sleep.gif)
https://forums.e-hentai.org/index.php?showt...p;#entry5460284

- snip -

No problems. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) I never get annoyed with your settings, nor anyone's. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/happy.gif) I just get annoyed at my bad luck, but that's another matter. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif) (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

I understand your point of view and everything you have already explained, and as I said before, I am not able to do the exact same thing. The question is that acnx365 asked "anyone with experience", and to my knowledge, only you and I usually talk about this comparison between Rapier and Shortsword (at least recently). So I decided to post the link of my tests, and let the person decide to do their own test to come to a conclusion of their own.

Unfortunately almost nobody does comparative tests with the melee style equipment. As most high level players become mages, most of the results presented are in this sense. I'll say it again: I would like more people to perform comparative tests. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

Just to put it in context, I decided to take this test because the vast majority of people said Rapier >>>>>>> Shortsword. And from my results I came to the conclusion that Rapier > Shortsword. That simple. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sleep.gif)

But stopping to think now, if a low level player has low deprecating proficiency, wouldn't it be better for him to play Rapier + Imperil style? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

PS: I am still awaiting your results using a Rapier. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

I have nothing against you, but next time you said something, I suggest that you first get a good grasp/proper understanding of what you're trying to say.
Choose whether you're trying to insult somebody or trying to look polite, since apparently you fail at both of them.

Also, even if what basara presented is faulty, you're no better than him by sharing partial information just to push your shortsword religion, and only disclose the worst part of it when somebody else mention the fault.

imperil for melee is fkin chore, and it's not personal preference, it's a fact that it take a lot to make it not being evaded and resisted more than half of the time.
you mention it's almost mindless in less than a second, but once again, you fail to mention the fact that those second doesn't warrant a full imperil stick
3 cast per round is easy, make those imperil stick on the monsters is a different question
only when basara link his result that you mention that without extra care imperil on melee have terrible success rate and call him not knowing what he's doing for not doing the extra care.

oh god, this is exactly the same as what vincento said a few days ago, no wonder I feel the deja vu.

I have fixed monsterbation so that I could spam Weaken/Imperil in every round, so it's alright. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)
My magical hit change right now is 84,4%
I have been play Imperil on rapier the moment it useable, so that my Depr prof is pretty goods.
The only problem is that I couldn't find Leg Rapier of Slaughter without it's near level 500 or milions credits, which I don't have (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/anime_cry.gif)
and I have pick this Shortsword with ranges near Peerless for less than 20k (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/faint.gif)
So I plan to use that Shortsword for some time while search for Rapier.
What do you think?

This post has been edited by acnx365: Sep 3 2019, 17:47

friendly reminder to all: this thread's purpose is to provide answers to questions of other players. I do question if arguing about the pro's and con's of different melee builds is very helpful to this purpose? I can appreciate that there are different opinions, different interpretation of facts, different findings, and different personal preferences. But what good does it do to keep repeating them?

Let's move on, shall we?

I have fixed monsterbation so that I could spam Weaken/Imperil in every round, so it's alright. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)
My magical hit change right now is 84,4%
I have been play Imperil on rapier the moment it useable, so that my Depr prof is pretty goods.
The only problem is that I couldn't find Leg Rapier of Slaughter without it's near level 500 or milions credits, which I don't have (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/anime_cry.gif)
and I have pick this Shortsword with ranges near Peerless for less than 20k (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/faint.gif)
So I plan to use that Shortsword for some time while search for Rapier.
How do you think?

I think that shorsword with imperil is a viable build. I think that rapier with imperil is a viable build. I think that rapier without imperil is a viable build. Just pick one, and we can go from there, you can ask questions on how to improve further when you get there.

So I plan to use that Shortsword for some time while search for Rapier.
What do you think?

I did it that way. I used a Legendary Rapier Balance, replaced it with a Legendary Shortsword Slaughter, and then a Legendary Rapier Slaughter. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/happy.gif)

Get a better (but still cheap) main hand weapon (Slaughter suffix, Mag+, 3 PABS).
If you can get someone to IW them for you (whatever free IW, since you'll change them again around 250 more or less, and targeted IW is a cost not justified below good Leg.)
At least for the main hand, forge at least the PABS and ADB up to 5, DEX/END a bit more)

Can't find any in WTS(or I have zero ability to read)

The closest I have is this Mag Club of Slaughter

2 PABS only, is it passable?

Can't find any in WTS(or I have zero ability to read)

The closest I have is this Mag Club of Slaughter

2 PABS only, is it passable?

Just be patient, your level isnt the best to find good weapons, but it gets easier later on. Well, the club sure as sure isnt the best, but i would say it is a good start.

friendly reminder to all: this thread's purpose is to provide answers to questions of other players. I do question if arguing about the pro's and con's of different melee builds is very helpful to this purpose? I can appreciate that there are different opinions, different interpretation of facts, different findings, and different personal preferences. But what good does it do to keep repeating them?

Let's move on, shall we?

From a newbie's point of view? Very informative.

I do usually learn more about the pros and cons of builds from these little arguments and fights than just from asking directly, because newbies don't have the ability to argue with veterans.

Why? Because you take out your artillery. You need to bring out proper (or made up, but with some effort) arguments, counter-arguments, numbers and resources into the table to win your little fight, instead of just dismissing a newbie with a "you have no idea about how this works" or a "you don't know what you're talking about" answer, that you know he won't be able to argue to it, because it's usually true.

See that you can call each other idiots and yet, you can't dismiss the other part's arguments. At least, not as easily as you dismiss a newbie, because you're arguing with an equal, not advising an inferior one.


As for the fact about repeating them, this happens because we newbies ask these questions in a cyclical way, as they get buried in posts in this thread.

This thread is helpful as a source of information (1st post) and as a means to ask things that are immediate.

After that, the source of information is the Wiki, that AFAIK, some users have already complained that is incomplete. Add to that that the knowledge that is shared here isn't fed back to the Wiki, so the experience poured here goes down the drain and in the end there is a "need" to refresh it periodically by asking the same questions again and getting into the same arguments again.


Now, regarding the whole issue, I can't argue about technical matters as I'm going to be slapped as "you have no idea about what you're talking about", but it somehow comes to my mind that an expensive Rapier of Slaughter and a cheap Shortsword of Slaughter (at least, from looking at similar prices in market) have a similar behaviour regarding performance and clearing times, according to Basara Nekki's tests.

Of course, there are a lot of conclusions to be taken from this as clearing times don't depend only on the weapon, but that was the first thing that came to my mind: "so Shortsword aren't as shitty as they say?". And that's the least favourable conclusion for them, as Shortswords need their specific style and gears to be used properly, different from Rapiers.


Looking at the whole picture, I think that it's beneficial to the game that perception on Shortswords is being changed.

In the end, it's about opening a new alternative in a game where builds are pretty much set up, with only a few being "good", a few others being "second tier" and the rest being shit. I'd say that market and players would surely like to have one thing less to bazaar.

And that's a pity. I'm not sure if it's because of game mechanics, or because we are only willing to walk on threaded paths, but in the end, the fact that a piece of gear gets dismissed because of it's nature (Kite Shield, Leather, Plate, of the Vampire, of the Illithid...) means that either something's wrong with the game, or with the way it's being played.


PS: btw, for those interested, I'm going a tanky build, so no full "of Slaughter" for me. I've yet to hammer out the details, but either Rapier or Shortsword are fine to me, as I am already a heavy Imperil user (and Weaken) with a level of tolerance to non-Imperiled monsters of 0 to 2 at most (yes, very intolerant).

I guess I'll try both and see what suits me better, but I'm biased toward swords due to personal preferences.

PSS: in fact, I'm also looking at how the specifics of Vampire weapons work, like if they proc with counters like Bleeding Wound does and the exact amount they suck per turn (it says "base damage" on wiki, but not sure if weapon or character); so I want to investigate further on them.

This post has been edited by ahroun: Sep 3 2019, 23:52

Know what?
Say what you want, I won't care anymore. Bullshit is spread? I won't care anymore too. This thread is more and more a farce anyway, so why should I?

All I really need is to have a maniacal, evil laugh as I blaze my way past the bandwagon with my "shit" equipment and playstyle, leaving that bandwagon in the dust with my ass as only horizon. That, gentlemen, is my real reward.
I don't need anyone to approve, understand or try to follow my trail. I do what I want, when I want, how I want and I don't give a flying fuck to those who are not pleased with that. That, is my religion.

Really, it's about time I stop wasting my time here.
Bye bye~

(IMG:[i.imgur.com] https://i.imgur.com/KBQh1Gg.jpg)