[X] My Assistant

Level does matter, and he's at least got DD3 behind his back, so it won't really work out like that for your case lol. You could start maging after lv310 when imperil cooldown disappears, but you need at least 10m to have a functioning mage style and honestly at least 20m to properly play mage style.

I'd say based on my holy experiment that if you have these perks:
Vigorous Vitality
Effluent Ether
Resplendent Regeneration
Enigma Energizer
Evil Enchantress
Innate Arcana IV
Dæmon Duality III

All you need for a functional mage set is 5 mag pieces of armor (3 phase 2 prof cotton) that have a charged/radiant prefix (somewhere around your level, if possible soulfused)
If possible 5 forge on all of them.
Cheap staff (doesn't have to be destruction or anything, Oak of Focus works just fine for me) with counter resist.
If possible 5 forge on all staff attributes.

And.... That's pretty much it, I think?
Depending on what you can find in cheap auctions or what you get yourself from drops....

The whole armor set should run you ~2.5m at most (if you go for ~500k for each piece... Which is a bit high to be fair, but you know, charged/radiant aren't that common, even mag)

Staff, even a 50k minimum bid staff should probably work just fine. If you want to splurge a bit and get like ~1m worth staff it's worth it I think.

Forges should be ~200k to get prof cotton 5 forge on all and 25 forge on prof. ~1m per phase piece to 5 forge on all.
So ~3.4m ish, depending on mat cost.

You can def drop another mil for ~10-15 forges on staff too.

If you go and soulfuse the entire set, assuming ~750 fragments per piece (mag quality + slightly higher than your lvl)
That's 4.5m (including staff)


Soooo
2.5m armor
1m staff
4.4m forging
4.5m soulfusing

12.4m for a pretty damn viable mage set
Assuming you have the perks of course, not sure about without perks.
DD and enchantress help a lot I assume.

The biggest issue with my holy (crap it's so bad) mage run is that imperil is not that great at hitting (lack of prof on staff is a big hit to my depr prof).
And, of course, I have pretty low proficiency on holy in general so that hurts the run as well.

I'm sure with under 15m, even with fewer hath perks, you can easily build yourself a functional mage that will outperform any melee in arenas.

This post has been edited by KamuiSeph: Apr 6 2019, 14:30

All you need for a functional mage set is 5 mag pieces of armor (3 phase 2 prof cotton) that have a charged/radiant prefix (somewhere around your level, if possible soulfused)
If possible 5 forge on all of them.
Cheap staff (doesn't have to be destruction or anything, Oak of Focus works just fine for me) with counter resist.
If possible 5 forge on all staff attributes.

I think generally non-charged/radiant legendaries will outperform prefix magnificents for phases. Charged mag cloth is ok and may be preferably at lower budgets due to HGC prices.

I think generally non-charged/radiant legendaries will outperform prefix magnificents for phases. Charged mag cloth is ok and may be preferably at lower budgets due to HGC prices.

Correct. Though Legendary between Forge 0 and Forge 5 only cost MGC, and Mags cost LGC and MGC.

I think generally non-charged/radiant legendaries will outperform prefix magnificents for phases. Charged mag cloth is ok and may be preferably at lower budgets due to HGC prices.

Well, putting the whole budget thing aside; I kinda doubt that.
Unless you mean high EDB legendaries? anything below ~50% and I would wager the mag prefixed would be better.

Granted, I have not tested this out... But if you have 3 radiant mags on phase then it's roughly what, 150-300 bonus MDB? Seeing as my entire staff is giving me 500 MDB I think that's a pretty big BUMP in damage. You would lose out on EDB, but not by 50% of your total EDB. My crap holy is at 185.3% total. If I swap it out for legendaries, how much is it going to bump up, actually? 20% total, maybe?

Not much I think.

Correct. Though Legendary between Forge 0 and Forge 5 only cost MGC, and Mags cost LGC and MGC.

Yeah - I meant for mag cotton proficiency and some other cheaper bindings can be used to forge to 15 without needing HGC.

Well, putting the whole budget thing aside; I kinda doubt that.
Unless you mean high EDB legendaries? anything below ~50% and I would wager the mag prefixed would be better.

Granted, I have not tested this out... But if you have 3 radiant mags on phase then it's roughly what, 150-300 bonus MDB? Seeing as my entire staff is giving me 500 MDB I think that's a pretty big BUMP in damage. You would lose out on EDB, but not by 50% of your total EDB. My crap holy is at 185.3% total. If I swap it out for legendaries, how much is it going to bump up, actually? 20% total, maybe?

Not much I think.

A few points:

1. Your staff is not great, MDB should be considerably higher than that normally. But even with a bad staff, your total magic damage should be near 4000, so 200-300 is around 5-7.5% of total magic damage. On the other hand, if you are at 185% EBD, then you are at effectively 285% elemental damage, so you need around 14-21% more EDB for damage to break-even. From my own calc (since I actually run 2 mag radiants) a very high roll mag radiant will outperform even peerless non-prefix legendary on my 1h mage (around 2.3k magic damage), but is inferior to even decent-roll legendaries on my mage (around 4.1k magic damage). However, this is only taking into account damage.

2. Legendaries will also have better defensive stats and PABs which will make average-roll legendaries preferable for mage. Charged mag is a different story, but you lose damage at the expense of more safety.

In general, unless you are on 1h mage, I'd say plain leg phase with decent rolls will be better than anything other than almost perfect-foll mag phases.

p.s. on a side note, Mystic, from my rough calculations, is a bit better than half a radiant with similar rolls for schoolgirls (but probably barely better than plain for non-SGs).

1. Your staff is not great, MDB should be considerably higher than that normally. But even with a bad staff, your total magic damage should be near 4000, so 200-300 is around 5-7.5% of total magic damage. On the other hand, if you are at 185% EBD, then you are at effectively 285% elemental damage, so you need around 14-21% more EDB for damage to break-even. From my own calc (since I actually run 2 mag radiants) a very high roll mag radiant will outperform even peerless non-prefix legendary on my 1h mage (around 2.3k magic damage), but is inferior to even decent-roll legendaries on my mage (around 4.1k magic damage). However, this is only taking into account damage.

2. Legendaries will also have better defensive stats and PABs which will make average-roll legendaries preferable for mage. Charged mag is a different story, but you lose damage at the expense of more safety.

In general, unless you are on 1h mage, I'd say plain leg phase with decent rolls will be better than anything other than almost perfect-foll mag phases.

p.s. on a side note, Mystic, from my rough calculations, is a bit better than half a radiant with similar rolls for schoolgirls (but probably barely better than plain for non-SGs).

Literally linked my stats above man.

Magical Attack
2718 magic base damage

I would be curious to actually test this out.
Now I need a full set of plain legendaries....

Hmmm. If someone has a plain holy non-soulfused set to loan out for a single arena run, hit me up (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Literally linked my stats above man.

Magical Attack
2718 magic base damage

I would be curious to actually test this out.
Now I need a full set of plain legendaries....

Hmmm. If someone has a plain holy non-soulfused set to loan out for a single arena run, hit me up (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

How... I have 2311 magic base damage on my 1h mage. Are you sure you have the right abilities slotted? But yeah, at 2.7k from a pure offensive perspective a good radiant mag will be stronger than average plain leg.

How... I have 2311 magic base damage on my 1h mage. Are you sure you have the right abilities slotted? But yeah, at 2.7k from a pure offensive perspective a good radiant mag will be stronger than average plain leg.

I think your estimation that ~4k is what you would get with an unforged non-destruction staff is ridiculous lol

With my fully forged staff (of destruction, 66% MDB http://hentaiverse.org/equip/149680091/b218b62809 ) I get 4032
MDB

Are you sure you're not just looking at it with full radiant armor and misinterpreting the numbers?

No radiants gives me 4k with a fully forged staff.
How much are you getting without your radiants?



Also, your 1H mage has FULL RADIANTS bro. Come on. Of course it's going to be high lol



Edit edit:

Hence why I'm saying even mag radiants/charged is probably better than plain prefix leg.

This post has been edited by KamuiSeph: Apr 6 2019, 21:50

I think your estimation that ~4k is what you would get with an unforged non-destruction staff is ridiculous lol

With my fully forged staff (of destruction, 66% MDB http://hentaiverse.org/equip/149680091/b218b62809 ) I get 4032
MDB

Are you sure you're not just looking at it with full radiant armor and misinterpreting the numbers?

No radiants gives me 4k with a fully forged staff.
How much are you getting without your radiants?
Also, your 1H mage has FULL RADIANTS bro. Come on. Of course it's going to be high lol
Edit edit:

Hence why I'm saying even mag radiants/charged is probably better than plain prefix leg.

Well, I was speaking in general terms since you were giving a general advice about cheap mage builds - unforged non-destruction (other than EDB) staffs are not commonly used for a reason... As far as I know it's generally accepted that decent plain leg is preferred over decent radiant/charged mags.

I was giving numbers because it was clear that you were very confused about the impact on damage from MDB vs EDB (since you were talking about how radiants give you 50% more MDB).

Well, I was speaking in general terms since you were giving a general advice about cheap mage builds - unforged non-destruction (other than EDB) staffs are not commonly used for a reason... As far as I know it's generally accepted that decent plain leg is preferred over decent radiant/charged mags.

I was giving numbers because it was clear that you were very confused about the impact on damage from MDB vs EDB (since you were talking about how radiants give you 50% more MDB).

Sorry, I was going off of the holy oak build I tried. And as there's no destruction holy oak suffix....

I am actually not sure at all about the formulas on MDB vs EDB impact.
Is there a wiki page on it or smth?

This post has been edited by KamuiSeph: Apr 7 2019, 02:07

Sorry, I was going off of the holy oak build I tried. And as there's no destruction holy oak suffix....

I am actually not sure at all about the formulas on MDB vs EDB impact.
Is there a wiki page on it or smth?

I think damage is usually a random factor (0.8-1.2) x spell multiplier x total element magic damage (x other multipliers like DD).

Total element magic damage should be magic base damage x (1 + element bonus damage).

So the effect of radiants affect the left side, whereas the element bonus damage difference between phases affect the right side.

The easiest way to estimate the relative impact of your final damage is to consider the impact to either side as a percentage. (A 4% increase in magic base damage is going to be about the same as a 4% increase in 100% + element bonus damage). So, if we use 4,000 magic base damage and 300% EBD (which is probably a bit too little MBD and a bit too much EBD for a typical elemental mage build around lvl 400, but will make the calculation easy), then 80 magic base damage from a radiant is roughly a 2% increase in damage. This roughly corresponds to (100% + 300%) x 2% = 8% EBD on the phase.

Mmm, using those assumptions, radiant mag should actually be a bit better purely offensively than plain leg for similar rolls (since mag to leg difference on EBD probably is quite a bit lower than 8% - probably closer to 4-5%).

Not fully sure if my understanding of magic damage vs EBD is correct - could any experts confirm or correct?

Not fully sure if my understanding of magic damage vs EBD is correct - could any experts confirm or correct?

Would def like to find out.

Also the difference between low/mid roll plain leg and mid/high roll charged mag.

I think with casting speed there's not really a clear cut formula to calculate differences (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sleep.gif)

Just in time.

Suggestions for improvement are welcome


This post has been edited by The_Ellimist: Apr 21 2019, 20:50

Suggestions for improvement are welcome

Your build is quite perfect build for arenas.
Can you finish DwD within 1.9k turns?

Your build is quite perfect build for arenas.
Can you finish DwD within 1.9k turns?

2.2K turns is average. I like to grind with edibles thou. Sometimes that slows me down.

Left Stats: When I arrived at level 480. (01/05/2019)

Right Stats: After upgrading the ADB (level 13 to 25) in all 14 Power equipments, and replacement a Legendary Shielding Helmet by a Peerless one. (today)

(IMG:[imgur.com] https://imgur.com/5sivpbT.jpg)____(IMG:[imgur.com] https://imgur.com/YQH1bMQ.jpg)

Even when i am quite happy with those improvements, i am quite sad that i couldnt increase my block in any way. Well i guess 0.4% additional parry has to be enough. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Could some (imperil) mages capable of consistent full pfests post their stats, as well as whether they need any consumables to do so? Also any changes to their usual strategy that are necessary. Thank you.

This post has been edited by lestion: Jun 1 2019, 04:17