[X] My Assistant

I was thinking about something:

Effective Primary Stats
630 agility

Is THIS that i have to kwwp at max at 500?

It is so harmful for 1H to have 1.8 % attack speed bonus and 5.9 % evade chance?

I was thinking about something:

Effective Primary Stats
630 agility

Is THIS that i have to kwwp at max at 500?

It is so harmful for 1H to have 1.8 % attack speed bonus and 5.9 % evade chance?

Nah that's fine (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

Any advice pls? should I use Power or Shielding Plate?


This post has been edited by sclszjx: Jun 8 2020, 07:44

Power armor. The additional block is not worth the lack of additional damage.

Any advice pls? should I use Power or Shielding Plate?

if you need more block, get a better shield (and slot your 1h-shield ability if you haven't) 36% at your level seems horrendously low.

It is so harmful for 1H to have 1.8 % attack speed bonus and 5.9 % evade chance?

Yes.
Especially when you can invest so much exp in END, STR or DEX.

Ok, i'm reducing it then i see.

630 agility

It is so harmful for 1H to have 1.8 % attack speed bonus and 5.9 % evade chance?

I'm not sure. Currently thinking about and investigating it myself in Research thread. In the meantime just see what other people say I guess. I always change my mind anyway.

I'm still looking into it but my current ovrall Agility is 523 and i gained speed in doing DWD compared to a level of Dæmon Duality Hath Perk, so near 5%.

Counting that my next Dæmon Duality Perk is 20K Hath it is good.

The only thing is that in the end i only get a couple of point in other stats (i will probably get 3 points in Endurance and some spare for Intelligance).

5% time penalty for just losing 1.8% attack speed and 5.9% evade seems too high, I would try to make sure it isn't luck or the day of the week (friday) or something else. You know that 1H will be faster by 5% on friday, right?

Actually lowering your Agility from 630 to 523 probably wouldn't get rid of too much evade, just get rid of all your attack speed. So then the question is can 1.8% attack speed (equivalent to Swift Strike Lv.1) cause 5% harm to your clear rate? Even if it's harmful, that much harm seems unlikely.

When Basara and I tested Haste, which is +50% action speed (or +33% depending how you look at it), we found only a 1% ~ 5% harm to our turns at most.

I know week bonus but it seem on Wednesday and Friday i'm even faster.

I will continue dropping Agi until i have 500 or less without losing more physical mitigation and play a month, then i will say something more.

poor proficiency (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cry.gif)


This post has been edited by Matsuoka Rina: Jun 25 2020, 11:24

My Old Stats

My new stats:



I changed my Armor with form a Legendary Savage Slaughter to a Peerless Cobalt Slaughter and reduced my Agility from 637 to 503 (making it 500 won't do anything, i just wast some experience).

I gained a total speed factor of near 4%, i don't know how much the less agility do in this matter but i'll say a 2+%.

2% penalty for having 1.8% attack speed is more than I'd expect, but it's possible. From your proficiencies it appears you use Imperil style (but I don't know how many Imperil casts per round?) in which case the following results might apply to you if the timing is right. The timing partially depends on your damage level (DD, adb, whether you use spirit stance with OFC, etc).

A reason I provided a breakdown of all the glitch components of attack speed is that in case you don't believe in various effects (turns/second boost, Overwhelming Strikes improvement, etc) we can just look at each contributing term and pick the desired ones. Having a tiny amount of attack speed does have negative components on the order of 1%, which could easily be 2% if I made some mistakes in thinking.

What kind of scenario did you use to test with? Grindfest, arena, SG arena, mixture? Do you check turns or time? If the loss is indeed 2%, that would be measurable by other players too, and worth it for others to verify. (My expectation though is that while the effect can be significant, it should be smaller and too difficult to test directly).

Returning to the 1H analysis of swift strike and low amounts of attack speed, if any spells (e.g. Imperil) are cast the cluster of turns with enhanced ailment durations will move up...A possibility is that the full ailment cluster occurs in the early turns.

There will be 4 turns of enhanced Stuns which isn't too bad in arenas because we are modeling 5 enemy mobs. This means that only 5 long Stuns will be inflicted. Assuming 13 stuns overall the average duration is 3.384615, scaling to the 4.66 duration of haste gives 0.384615 * 6% / 1.66 = 1.384615% which I'll reduce by 1/5 to 1.107692% penalty after considering the side benefits of stun.

The overall impact on offense is thus 0.454545% + 0.714286% - 1.107692% - 0.04% = 0.021139% so effectively no change in turns. This leaves 0.2% + 0.267115% + 0.021139% = 0.488254% benefit to time, which is a bit more than butcher. This is the result of glitch abuse that I originally alluded to, but I guess it's still not broken in the end.


There will be 4 turns of enhanced Stuns which is worse in grindfest because we have a full mob of 9. I will assume 7 enhanced Stuns will be inflicted. Compared to 31.5 stuns overall, the average stun duration is 3.222222 which gives 0.222222 * 8.25% / 1.66 = 1.1% which I'll reduce by 1/9 to 0.977778% penalty due to side benefits of stun.

The overall impact on offense is 0.191388% + 0.396825% - 0.977778% - 0.055% = -0.444565% penalty in turns and 0.148148% + 0.42% - 0.444565% = 0.123583% benefit to time. Though contributing components are wild the final result is mundane. I surmise that grindfest's large mobs created a balance with the good and bad aspects of enhanced ailment durations.

I used DWD only for test.

I use 1 Imperil each turn to get Prof.

Testing this Imperil or Not Imperil the result is near the same, the completion time difference is so little that is useless.

I also use Spirit Stance all i can and OFC with it on.

But yes, my current completion time fluctate form 20 minutes 30 seconds to 22 minutes 30 seconds now, i reduced it by a bit more than a minute.

Finished X20 GF with 1H mage for the first time.

Perks I have: Enigma Energizer,Eminent Elementalist, Innate Arcana II, Dæmon Duality I.

Here are the charactor and the battle stats:




Forge info:

Full forged on EDB and parry of waki, full forged on block of buckler, full forged on Ele prof of shoes.
None forge on phase.




Some info by myself:

I used aether shard, you could see there are no miss on magic attack, and mana elixir is not "necessary" in my case.

My imp strategy is to cast imperil once on monster B E H, then cast T3-T2-T1. I didn't have Evil Enchantress perk and high level of assimilator, so my imp got resisted by monsters a lot.

Spirit potion is mostly used (usually used as soon as it's cooled down) after round 650, spirit drought is enough before that.

My spark of life (Innate Arcana)were only triggered 2 times. I always keep my sp above 60% to avoid possible failure of spark of life.

OFC damage is low, seems overcharge is not useful in this fighting style.


Further test/question：

1. If Evil Enchantress affect much on success rate of IMP, in my case, assuming that there are 9 monsters and I cast IMP to monster B E H, only 5~7 of 9 will get imperiled.

2. If change the cotton slot from shoes to other slot or use 3+2(glove), there will be increase of PF factor(more mitigation reduction and elemental CR) and decrease of EDB. My current shoes has a element prof of 47%. Which equipment choice is better in total?

3. Should I only cast attack magic until all the monsters are imperiled? Or just most of them?

4. Buckler of battlecaster may save more mana poition, but have a lower block chance, not sure if it could support the last 300 rounds safely, or it may need more spirit elixir.




This post has been edited by Bolide: Jul 8 2020, 16:29

...
Further test/question：

1. If Evil Enchantress affect much on success rate of IMP, in my case, assuming that there are 9 monsters and I cast IMP to monster B E H, only 5~7 of 9 will get imperiled.

2. If change the cotton slot from shoes to other slot or use 3+2(glove), there will be increase of PF factor(more mitigation reduction and elemental CR) and decrease of EDB. My current shoes has a element prof of 47%. Which equipment choice is better in total?

3. Should I only cast attack magic until all the monsters are imperiled? Or just most of them?

4. Buckler of battlecaster may save more mana poition, but have a lower block chance, not sure if it could support the last 300 rounds safely, or it may need more spirit elixir.

Congrats, good job.

1) Yes, it should reduce your imperils by about 100-150 per run. This isn't hugely significant when it's taking 16k turns, but it becomes a much bigger optimization for most mages once you get lower. (There may be other, cheaper ways to get faster to consider first.)

2) 1H Mage is extremely short on proficiency because you don't get any from weapon/shield - I'd recommend at least playing 3+2 using a very strong slot like robe or pants as your prof slot, and possibly both robe and pants (instead of shoes). You do not need to hit 0.79 - the balance will be weird because your overall damage will be low anyway - but you should see more damage (and safety!) by raising your prof more at the moment.

3) If you're going to imperil at all as a mage, you should imperil the entire round (except against schoolgirl arenas). This is because the turns it takes to clear a round will always be determined by the slowest monster to die, and you are hitting everything at the same time with your T3, and most of the round with T2.

4) I don't recommend battlecaster at all: I would personally rather use nimble wakizashi and DEA barrier buckler. 1H mage suffers from one big problem: slower damage means longer rounds, longer rounds means more SP attacks. The survival difference from parry will be pretty big - and also probably reduce mana cost of healing. You can get the magic accuracy from aether shards, and if necessary, forging your armor. This is a controversial point: others will disagree and insist battlecaster is better. You will need to choose for yourself.

edit: you could reduce your mana potion usage by using spirit stance when your OC is full - it reduces mana cost of spells

This post has been edited by lestion: Jul 8 2020, 16:54

Congrats, good job.

1) Yes, it should reduce your imperils by about 100-150 per run. This isn't hugely significant when it's taking 16k turns, but it becomes a much bigger optimization for most mages once you get lower. (There may be other, cheaper ways to get faster to consider first.)

2) 1H Mage is extremely short on proficiency because you don't get any from weapon/shield - I'd recommend at least playing 3+2 using a very strong slot like robe or pants as your prof slot, and possibly both robe and pants (instead of shoes). You do not need to hit 0.79 - the balance will be weird because your overall damage will be low anyway - but you should see more damage (and safety!) by raising your prof more at the moment.

3) If you're going to imperil at all as a mage, you should imperil the entire round (except against schoolgirl arenas). This is because the turns it takes to clear a round will always be determined by the slowest monster to die, and you are hitting everything at the same time with your T3, and most of the round with T2.

4) I don't recommend battlecaster at all: I would personally rather use nimble wakizashi and DEA barrier buckler. 1H mage suffers from one big problem: slower damage means longer rounds, longer rounds means more SP attacks. The survival difference from parry will be pretty big - and also probably reduce mana cost of healing. You can get the magic accuracy from aether shards, and if necessary, forging your armor. This is a controversial point: others will disagree and insist battlecaster is better. You will need to choose for yourself.

edit: you could reduce your mana potion usage by using spirit stance when your OC is full - it reduces mana cost of spells

Thanks for the reply.

I'm not good at english, so I don't quite understand 3). You mean I should get all the monsters imperiled then start to use T3/T2/T1?

Played as 1h mage(without deprecating perk) means I have quite little Deprecating CR which make it hard to land every monster imperiled, I had failed 5 times on a monster during a RE lator. But 1h mage has a much better defense than my normal cold mage, so it's possible to cast several imp on monsters without breaking SOL.

For 2）you suggested, I have a 95% cotton robe of elementalist. If I replace it with the phase one, I will get prof factor increased from 0.45 to 0.75, cold CR from 22.5% to 37.5%, but the EDB will decrease from 245% to 185%, and there are little loss in other attributes such as int/wis/evd.
Will the benefit from this replacement exceed the loss?

Also I could forge the cotton robe to make the pf factor to.079 or more, but I don't know the suggested PF factor of 1h mage...

Thanks for the reply.

I'm not good at english, so I don't quite understand 3). You mean I should get all the monsters imperiled then start to use T3/T2/T1?

Played as 1h mage(without deprecating perk) means I have quite little Deprecating CR which make it hard to land every monster imperiled, I had failed 5 times on a monster during a RE lator. But 1h mage has a much better defense than my normal cold mage, so it's possible to cast several imp on monsters without breaking SOL.

For 2）you suggested, I have a 95% cotton robe of elementalist. If I replace it with the phase one, I will get prof factor increased from 0.45 to 0.75, cold CR from 22.5% to 37.5%, but the EDB will decrease from 245% to 185%, and there are little loss in other attributes such as int/wis/evd.
Will the benefit from this replacement exceed the loss?

Also I could forge the cotton robe to make the pf factor to.079 or more, but I don't know the suggested PF factor of 1h mage...

I tested it a while a ago, the prof factor for 1h mage. Optimum is same as normal mage, but you can stay a little bit lower because you're slow anyway. The optimum is 0.79 prof factor. But you won't notice the difference from 0.75 to 0.79 as 1h mage.

I tested it a while a ago, the prof factor for 1h mage. Optimum is same as normal mage, but you can stay a little bit lower because you're slow anyway. The optimum is 0.79 prof factor. But you won't notice the difference from 0.75 to 0.79 as 1h mage.

I tested two equipment plan in X20 100 round IW(for a peerless shade) just now. GF costs to much time. so I choose IW instead.

Plan 1 is using 4 phase +1 cotton shoes(full forged prof), pf factor 0.452, edb 245.6%. I used 471 imp and 1499 turns.




Plan 2 is using 3 phase + 2 cotton (robe forged 10+shoes full forged prof), pf factor 0.792, edb 184.8%. I used 470 imp and 1529 turns.




You could find plan 1 has less turns than plan 2 although plan 2 has the "optimum" pf factor 0.79.

That may because plan 2 only has a higher score in mitigation 75% monsters, but there are much more monsters which has less than 75% mitigations in which plan 1 has a better magic score. I'm not sure how does sssss2 calculate it, but it meets my test result in my situation .

So maybe players should test based on their own charactor to see whether 1h mage should have 3+2 or 4+1/prof 0.75+ or not.

Also I'm not sure which score in HV utils can be the key data which could tell the player if their change in equipment is good or not. We can only see the predicted score of 50% 60% 70% 75% mitigations but we don't know the monster percentage of different mitigations...

I knew 0.452 is too low for a mage, and I plan to buy a decent phase shoes and forge my cotton robe to have a better prof in the future. But still I'm not sure if the benefit from prof factor could beat the loss in edb (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)


EDIT: Sorry for decon, I met an error just now so the post is sent twice before fully typed.

This post has been edited by Bolide: Jul 12 2020, 10:02