[X] My Assistant

Protencies subject to staff:

Annihilator Spell Crit Damage
Archmage Bonus Magic Damage
Economizer Mana Conservation
Penetration Counter-Resist
Spellweaver Cast Speed

Obvious choice is Economizer. What is the next one?

On a destruction staff I'd say.
1. Economizer Mana Conservation.
2. Penetration

See above. Archmage might better on non-PFUDOR difficulties than penetration for destruction, but resist is so damn annoying.

Annihilator is worst, of course, even on a non-destro staff.

See above. Archmage might better on non-PFUDOR difficulties than penetration for destruction, but resist is so damn annoying.

Annihilator is worst, of course, even on a non-destro staff.

I'm actually having a hard time figuring out which is better between the 2. Since Anni applies on total damage, while Arch only applies on staff. The question is, exactly how much that 2% on staff affects the total damage.

That aside, worst for me would be Weaver.

Oversoul: It isn't that hard to figure out - use Math™. Don't forget to account for crit and crit damage from arcane focus and forging on even non-edb staves.

And weaver gives so little damage(0) that I forgot about it. Might be good in gf though to avoid the horrible spirit drain in later rounds.

Oversoul: It isn't that hard to figure out - use Math™. Don't forget to account for crit and crit damage from arcane focus and forging on even non-edb staves.

And weaver gives so little damage(0) that I forgot about it. Might be good in gf though to avoid the horrible spirit drain in later rounds.

You probably haven't done the math yourself, I'm just saying there's always a possibility Anni might be superior to Arch based on the fact that Fatality is superior to Butcher in some cases. We shouldn't make conclusions so easily.

Economizer and penetrator, the others are an eyesore.

This post has been edited by danixxx: Jan 11 2014, 00:37

ya before the batch Archmage is second to economizer, now I concur with you

Oversoul: In my fire set(unforged edb ebony staff), the math comes out as follows:

2155 MDB / 462.39 on staff

30.1 crit

AF at 325: +10 crit chance (also +25% magic damage but that doesn't matter here), +12% crit damage

Archmage: damage increase by 0.02*462.39/2155 * 100% =*0.429%
Annihilator: damage increase by 2/162 * (1-(1-0.3)*(1-0.1)) * 100% = 0.457%

So, best case scenario for Annihilator (unforged EDB staff) has it coming out 6.47% stronger....Whoops, did I just notice these 4 destruction bindings in my inventory?

I mean, sure, if you have old oak with 15 MDB Annihilator could actually remain ok. But it is very easy to increase staff MDB to total MDB ratio and very hard to increase crit(as INT/WIS forging has awful results, which is where most crit comes from). Lower levels will have lower crit, but higher levels will have more cash - in fact, unforged staff is pretty abnormal when IWing costs several times more than few of it.

Thus I stand my point.

As for penetrator, it is 4% on resist, making one need about 10% resist to match arhcmage in this scenario on surface, but that doesn't exactly account for wasted damage when monster resists and you hit only 1 or 2 monsters instead of 5 to all.

That's why I'm saying it's situational, what you did was just a single case study (which proved against your point). Even so, you can't just say on lvl x with these factors, arch is better, thus arch is superior. Everything is relative and has different value at different points.

Also, crit chance scales with cloth spellcrit, which is another 10% at lvl 400, making 50%+ crit chance realistic at that level.

It is unreasonable to take levels average player won't reach any time soon(this goes for you and me both tbh), but you have to consider your level and staff first. Feel free to do the same math for your situation, though like I said, given the costs, it is reasonable to expect people who IW also to forge(imho, but those who don't , feel free do not account for that) - hence why I got at how annihilator scales awfully.

Singe case study it may be, but there is not anything overly special about the rolls on my old set. One could use equipment ranges data instead if they wished, but that wouldn't be completely accurate either as this scenario is overly dependent on staff MDB.

Though, imho there is another, more important POV on this: penetrator isn't so good because of the average cost of resist but because it culls the the stragglers. Annihilator only brings your maximum damage up, which is not so useful if you want to avoid stragglers, while archmage does.

This post has been edited by Lement: Jan 11 2014, 16:55

Honestly, lvl 400 is easily reachable in 2 weeks for me (20m+ exp from TT-DwD), but sadly, I won't be able to play this month.

I'm only giving an example because you seem to be generalizing and not accounting for cloth crit scaling. But I've already stated my point, I don't think arch is superior in every case. Additionally, you're assuming people who IW will forge, but that's unlikely for most people in the 200s. People below that probably won't do either.

Protencies subject to staff:

Annihilator Spell Crit Damage
Archmage Bonus Magic Damage
Economizer Mana Conservation
Penetration Counter-Resist
Spellweaver Cast Speed

Obvious choice is Economizer. What is the next one?

The Potency i get high at first try. Yes I'm that lazy.