 |
 |
 |
Cheating the HV! |
|
Jun 17 2013, 17:42
|
Tenboro

|
QUOTE Why does he want me to come back if he knows I'm cheating? Because for some reason I can't quite explain, I find his suffering amusing? Besides, no one has managed to break PONIES. Trust me, I'd know.
|
|
|
Jun 17 2013, 17:47
|
Frostbite
Group: Members
Posts: 7,135
Joined: 3-July 08

|
QUOTE(indiexanna @ Jun 17 2013, 04:19)  Back then (when I was just starting) I wasn't familiar with those ponies names, mazes were my friend. Always solved 'em in around 3-10 seconds.
I missed the maze when it was updated, but now I'm getting used with the ponies.
Actually I missed the maze too, I rarely make mistake with ponies, but sometimes when I'm just dizzy it's often miss the mark (IMG:[ invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) btw, (IMG:[ s23.postimg.org] http://s23.postimg.org/6zf0vswwb/Tenboro.png)
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Jun 17 2013, 17:48
|
Ichy
Group: Catgirl Camarilla
Posts: 13,061
Joined: 19-February 09

|
QUOTE(Tenboro @ Jun 17 2013, 17:42)  Because for some reason I can't quite explain, I find his suffering amusing?
Besides, no one has managed to break PONIES. Trust me, I'd know.
oh and for a moment I was thinking his quit was related to this patch note: QUOTE - Minor alterations to PONIES™ to defeat certain theoretical attacks.
|
|
|
Jun 17 2013, 18:01
|
Ebisan
Group: Members
Posts: 785
Joined: 1-December 12

|
I guess you need cheaters to know your system weak points and they have given probably lots of ideas of things that need tweaking. Cheap but efficient beta-testing (IMG:[ invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif). Love for your black sheep. (IMG:[ invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
|
|
|
Jun 17 2013, 18:14
|
Tenboro

|
QUOTE(Ichy @ Jun 17 2013, 17:48)  oh and for a moment I was thinking his quit was related to this patch note: Someone theorized that you may have been able to break it if you had a copy of all the vectors and the computing power to try matching them all. Which should be much, much harder after the changes I made.
|
|
|
Jun 17 2013, 18:38
|
Msgr. Radixius
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 30,859
Joined: 15-May 06

|
QUOTE(rainbowmagnum @ Jun 17 2013, 10:18)  I think Frith needs to just chill and perhaps visit one of many fine methadone clinics this palnet has to offer.
Those Method One acting clinics are mighty fine establishments.
|
|
|
Jun 17 2013, 18:43
|
Necromusume
Group: Catgirl Camarilla
Posts: 7,057
Joined: 17-May 12

|
He told me he had a trio of pigeons trained to recognize the mane 6, and that the consensus output of the three was almost always correct. He used to use the jar with Elvis's brain in it, but the greys wanted it back.
|
|
|
Jun 17 2013, 19:11
|
Mags_
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 13,744
Joined: 14-March 11

|
QUOTE(radixius @ Jun 18 2013, 02:38)  Those Method One acting clinics are mighty fine establishments.
Especially with their free palnet refinement services. QUOTE(mechafujoshi @ Jun 18 2013, 02:43)  He told me he had a trio of pigeons trained to recognize the mane 6, and that the consensus output of the three was almost always correct. He used to use the jar with Elvis's brain in it, but the greys wanted it back.
[attachembed=26698]
|
|
|
Jun 17 2013, 20:02
|
Cashino
Group: Members
Posts: 587
Joined: 23-August 08

|
QUOTE I've been cheating the entire time! QUOTE I, on the other hand, am totally innocent! wut
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Jun 17 2013, 20:52
|
Ichy
Group: Catgirl Camarilla
Posts: 13,061
Joined: 19-February 09

|
QUOTE It's true that ponies would be very hard to circumvent, but they're not very effective in stopping cheating. The flaw with ponies is that they cause very little inconvenience for cheaters.
When I was at the computer I just had an audio alert when the ponies came up and I submitted an answer manually. When I was away from the computer I sent an alert to my phone and had four big buttons appear that were easy to press on the touch screen. Responding to each pony only took a few seconds, so it was easy to run the entire time you were awake.
Tenboro did turn it up to Genocide Mode for a while and I was getting about one pony every five minutes. This apparently proved ineffective and he reduced it again, so it was about one every fifteen minutes for the weeks before the patch. A few seconds out of every fifteen minutes really isn't much of a deterrent.
Ponies stop you running 24/7, but other than that don't really do much to stop cheating. If somebody wanted to cheat for a few hours a day to get credits, ponies would do nothing to stop them. If somebody wants to cheat all day long, as I did, ponies does nothing to stop them.
As I say, the RiddleMaster doesn't work in general and there would be lots of better ways to stop cheating. cheating is such a full time job (IMG:[ invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) This post has been edited by Ichy: Jun 17 2013, 20:53
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Jun 17 2013, 21:26
|
grumpymal
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 10,923
Joined: 2-April 08

|
QUOTE(Ichy @ Jun 17 2013, 13:52)  cheating is such a full time job (IMG:[ invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) It'd probably be easier to outsource it to some Chinese gold farmer.
|
|
|
Jun 17 2013, 22:30
|
Malenk
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 1,130
Joined: 12-June 12

|
|
|
|
Jun 17 2013, 22:34
|
blue penguin
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 10,046
Joined: 24-March 12

|
QUOTE(Ichy @ Jun 17 2013, 19:52)  cheating is such a full time job (IMG:[ invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) Yup, at night he would need to wake up every 15 mins and select the right pony QUOTE(Tenboro @ Jun 17 2013, 16:42)  Because for some reason I can't quite explain, I find his suffering amusing?
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Jun 17 2013, 22:45
|
Lement
Group: Members
Posts: 2,977
Joined: 28-February 12

|
some more name editing(warning, may be offensive to some): QUOTE(Sanya V Litvyak @ Jun 17 2013) I was hoping to make a quite and dignified exit this time, but it seems Juutilainen won't be happy until I've made a scene, so I will.
I've been a witch the entire time!
I've never played the game and was a witch with both this account and my 501st account! Juutilainen is well aware of this but for some reason never banned me. I expected to be banned when I started flying 24/7 after he removed the fuel limit in 0.5.2, but despite my patently inhuman playing patterns I was never banned. Even if flying 24/7 didn't make it abundantly clear I was a witch, Erica posted on the forum multiple times saying I was a witch (Erica's a blabbermouth!). There's no way Juutilainen didn't know, yet he did nothing.
It's apparent that a lot of other players are witches as well. The players who reach level 300 in a week, the players who can generate inhuman quantities of items, the high-profile forum participants who appear to be able to do the impossible - I very much doubt they're achieving these things manually. But even when it's obvious somebody is a witch Juutilainen does nothing about it. Bizarrely, he takes auto-bidding on the hath auctions very seriously, with many players being banned for that, but nobody ever gets banned for being a witch in game, even when it's obvious that they are.
Rather than ban/punish witches Juutilainen takes the rather strange step of punishing the legitimate pilots. The first way legitimate pilots are punished is with the feeder brainwashing system. Melees are pointlessly simple so solve automatically but are a real nuisance to solve manually, so they cause no problems for witches but represent a massive annoyance for legitimate pilots. Juutilainen is well aware of this, yet he continues to punish the legitimate pilots by leaving Melees in the game. The Mages are considerably better, but still fail to stop witches while successfully pissing of a lot of people. Really, the whole feeder brainwashing system idea needs scrapping as there are far more effective at preventing witches without inconveniencing legitimate pilots.
I can't help but note Juutilainen's hypocrisy in using the brainwashing. He rails against the party for their use of KGB and other restrictions that punish legitimate pilots, yet me himself is operating a regular pilot protection system which has all the attributes of KGB:
Like KGB the brainwashing largely fails to achieve its intended goal. Like KGB the brainwashing inconveniences legitimate pilots while causing relatively few problems for witches. Like KGB the brainwashing results in false positives, with pilots losing money despite the fact they're not witches.
It's ridiculous to criticise the party for their use of mechanisms that restrict and punish legitimate pilots and then go on to do the exact same thing yourself.
Another way in which Juutilainen punishes legitimate pilots is that he actively designs the game around the witches. If he sees witches getting too many artefacts/credits/crystals/items/shards/whatever he nerfs the game for everyone. When he's deciding the cost of a particular upgrade/training/whatever he seems to look at what the witches are capable of getting and then chooses a price based on that. It's the people who aren't witches that suffer most from this. Their meagre income is cut further when he nerfs things for the witches, and the chance of legitimate pilots achieving anything is reduced when he sets prices that are completely out of their reach.
Juutilainen has admitted himself that he makes design decisions purely to piss me off, but in many cases this lead to other players suffering more. Instead of designing the game around the witches and punishing the legitimate pilots, why not ban the witches and design the game around the legitimate pilots?
Despite knowing I was a witch Juutilainen didn't appear to want me to quit. I thought he'd be happy to see me retire when I deleted my witches the first time, but instead he took action that stopped me retiring. On the day of the 0.76 patch I sent him a PM politely asking him to disable Eila so I could retire, but rather than do that he replied saying, "Eh, you'll be back". Why does he want me to come back if he knows I'm a witch? Not only is he failing to ban people who are witches, he's actively encouraging them to continue.
I've often said nothing Juutilainen does makes any sense, but the way in which he handles witches is particularly nonsensical:
1) Why isn't he banning players who he knows are witches? 2) Why is he continuing to use the brainwashing when the whole system is ineffective, and the Melees in particular are totally useless while being very annoying for legitimate pilots? 3) Why is he designing the game around the players who are witches and thus making it very hard for the players who aren't witches? 4) Why is he encouraging people who he knows are witches to continue playing?
The whole way in which Juutilainen handles witches is an outrage and he should be ashamed of himself! I, on the other hand, am totally innocent! In fact, I'm a victim of the whole situation and should be compensated with free upgrades to Prince and free wins/kills
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Jun 17 2013, 23:11
|
Mags_
Group: Gold Star Club
Posts: 13,744
Joined: 14-March 11

|
[attachembed=26704]
|
|
|
Jun 18 2013, 07:04
|
Ichy
Group: Catgirl Camarilla
Posts: 13,061
Joined: 19-February 09

|
QUOTE(Lement @ Jun 17 2013, 22:45)  some more name editing(warning, may be offensive to some):
(IMG:[ invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) On a serious note. Don't we want to burn these witches? Or at least turn them back to level 25 so they wont appear all the time and take a way the battle slots for legit created monsters?
|
|
|
Jun 18 2013, 07:21
|
Lement
Group: Members
Posts: 2,977
Joined: 28-February 12

|
See 0.77 and monsters being fed/having morale.
|
|
|
Jun 18 2013, 07:30
|
Cashino
Group: Members
Posts: 587
Joined: 23-August 08

|
QUOTE(Lement @ Jun 18 2013, 07:21)  See 0.77 and monsters being fed/having morale.
Except there's the "monsters above a certain PL" exception which, at the very least, Eila will be part of. If Eila wasn't such at a high level that it'd make the exception have practically no point, I have a feeling that the bar would have been set at "Eila's PL - 1"
|
|
|
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:
|
 |
 |
 |
|