[X] My Assistant

Mages used to be able to clear almost as many rounds of gf as they wanted, with 1 turn pern round, at difficulties higher than normal. Only Ichy complains that it was lost.

More then me but most are gone by now (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

Also we should have it back, or at least some killspeed. With Limits it wont be that much of a problem.
melee should be faster too, Tenb should just add 1-2 more Steps for PA and 5 more for Bleed.

15 hours ago: The site was apparently having some issues around midnight UTC due to a network outage. Seems like it recovered by itself.

24 hours later, same story.

FYI

Ed: Ummm, seems to work again.
Ed2: Nope, there it goes again.
Ed3: Well muck fe. It's all heile and then kaputt; alles durcheinander.
Ed4: I'm German.

This post has been edited by flint: Mar 23 2013, 01:06

1st: If you prefer your loot, that's fine, but loot being sufficient for character is completely different part of balance.

As is players' market(though always not being there is true....it only holds for some time period, not forever). Also, that mag already uses high grades, leg may not do that - plus if you're buying a legendary plate you're going to have the money for forging it too probably.

Resale: Since you already reached level 100 damage that and reforging it for more butcher is the only options for better weapons(though I suppose one can now resalvage in addition to resale). That's why I mentioned this, and that is why I mentioned legendaries(though none of your armors are even halfway to maxed in forge).

Prefix: Proofs about numbers are given with math. If it is not certain, it is given with probabilities. I find it quite unlikely that if prefix could decrease quality of an armor we wouldn't have average armor with prefix drop by now, even more so than power with shielding prefix due how much more common fine plate is. Prefix used to increase equip's quality, but that's in the past. I don't visit HVbar that often though, sorry.

Nerf: Do you not know how many mages lost the ability to go deeper than 2000, no, even 500 rounds in grindfest? Yeah, I suppose lot of them don't play that much anymore.

Anyway, IWBTH arenas are a imho several times easier than IWBTH IWs, which you talked about. Plus again, highest difficulty mode.

People leaving due becoming weaker can happen, and can be bad. But so is people leaving because there aren't options, or new players joining/quiting soon. If there would never have been a single nerf(unintentional or not) to players, all mages and melees could oneshot mid-difficulty waves, and medium strength ones would oneshot IWBTH. All the time. The competition would be who can kill IWBTH FSM in least amount of turns, with kills in one spell being the method of choice to kill it.

You know, those sound like terrible nerfs. It sounds like a terrible nerf to go from IWBTH rewards times 8(?) to current rewards in several times the time. But that game doesn't sound particularly interesting, either. And 0.7 patches aren't even so huge as some past patches in changes to a build when you compare them, so you have time to adjust. At least people quitting upon hitting 200 has been fixed.

Ping: A major problem. This cannot be fixed. This should be accounted for, too.

As for IW.....I don't know what you're doing with cure/scroll/aether that you end up consuming more than twice the resources for lesser success. But you're still not trying your hardest for pretty much one of the hardest things in game, so where will you go from here in regards to character progression? The only quantifiable things harder than what you're doing would be doing the same thing with even less defensive armor/even faster/using less items. There's also gf, but I doubt average 10 maxing to 30 crystals per round will beat 10 potency exp per round, if you talk in terms of rewards. I understand that your complaint here is in regards to character progression slowdown and backpedaling, but what would be then right?

In the end, this convo got started by Chosen mentioning melees being able to go 600 rounds IWBTHfest. Which is correct for "nearing perfection melees". Is that the goal in character progression? Possibly, since you're already doing the hardest possible thing. But given how often mages are taken from the best ones with hundreds of forges(hito's staff already is nearing twice the forges of your estoc) it is only fair if similar tier melees are used in comparison - after all, he has spent several times more than you on his holy gear(and has same ping, btw) he shouldn't be compared to you but rather either to a weaker mage or similarly spent melee.{Also, the balance problem he mentioned doesn't account for the different time to do an iwbth round between mage and melee at all.}

As you showed to yourself, using plate makes things easier - I bet if you used enough plate you could just use cure since you'd have enough mana for just the later rounds.
(BTW, with your interference with power gear and cure's tend to overheal bringing a godly health pot or health elixir instead of a mana pot might be more efficient usage of an item slot).

PS: I understand the wish to do arenas to gather credits and equipment, but I don't understand what's with this desire to level up in level-scaling game (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

about 1st and resale: if you are very rich, let's say, you have more than 1000m credits, you can forget what I said and try to buy the best of the best. Oh, btw, good luck with that because they are not easy to found. And even if you are that rich, you can also use the saving from this to unlock the hath perks and tranning. You know, in this game you can never ever have enough credit.

about the IW and GF: hum, you know what is the best? Until now, I still can not believe full plate is the best since it makes you have a low damage and low crit chance so that monsters are able to use red bar and blue bar skills against you. Maybe I should use some more plate gears to replace the power of slaughter gears but from what I can see, it looks like change from my current power of protection gear to MAG plate of protection gears can only provide me with such a tiny improve on PMI that is doubtful to change anything. To fight in GF to get crystal looks like a good idea. However, it is not so easy to sell. That's why I do not like to do this even I unlocked Crystarium III.

About other: Man, just try to Level yourself up in this level scaling game to see what gonna happen. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

I don't want to actually ask for an update, since that's the best way to delay it, but can someone start at least start talking about something else, so we can get away from this inane debate for at least 10 posts? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/heh.gif) Please? (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/duck.gif)

The problem with plate for people without high end gear is that any reduction in your killing speed is not made up by the additional protection that plate affords. because as has been pointed out many times the skill attacks from the monsters will hurt you far more wearing full plate than if you wear power with maybe 1 decent plate thrown in, as most monsters will be dead before they can use skill attacks(except for monsters that spawn with bars half full....).

The problem with plate for people without high end gear is that any reduction in your killing speed is not made up by the additional protection that plate affords. because as has been pointed out many times the skill attacks from the monsters will hurt you far more wearing full plate than if you wear power with maybe 1 decent plate thrown in, as most monsters will be dead before they can use skill attacks(except for monsters that spawn with bars half full....).

Dead wrong.

You obviously haven't tried IWBTH in full power. Mobs will still special you, and it hurts far more than using full plate.

Also, you made me lol. People without high-end gear should definitely not look at power, because they're 10x more expensive compared to plates.

Dead wrong.

You obviously haven't tried IWBTH in full power. Mobs will still special you, and it hurts far more than using full plate.

Also, you made me lol. People without high-end gear should definitely not look at power, because they're 10x more expensive compared to plates.

I do T&T IWBTH with this crappy set
Weapon Helmet Body Hands Legs Feet
I sometimes use This But it doesn't make any real difference, and the more plate I put the worse it gets because the magic attacks from the high level monsters all take off max amount of spirit. The physical skill attacks from the high level monsters still hit my spirit shield even with full plate, so there really is little use in using full plate as what I save in spirit from the physical attacks I lose twice over from the increased hits from the magic attacks. And my spirit consumption isnt a problem anyway, I usually only use 1 spirit pot would use 2 if full plate, but would have to use focus to recover mana with full plate.
Since this update I have tried all sorts of combinations with equipment and full power for T&T works better for me than anything else.
Also I realise this discussion was about IWBTH IW but I have no hope of that anyway.

This post has been edited by teddy.bear: Mar 23 2013, 05:09

I do T&T IWBTH with this crappy set
Weapon Helmet Body Hands Legs Feet
I sometimes use This But it doesn't make any real difference, and the more plate I put the worse it gets because the magic attacks from the high level monsters all take off max amount of spirit. The physical skill attacks from the high level monsters still hit my spirit shield even with full plate, so there really is little use in using full plate as what I save in spirit from the physical attacks I lose twice over from the increased hits from the magic attacks. And my spirit consumption isnt a problem anyway, I usually only use 1 spirit pot would use 2 if full plate, but would have to use focus to recover mana with full plate.
Since this update I have tried all sorts of combinations with equipment and full power for T&T works better for me than anything else.
Also I realise this discussion was about IWBTH IW but I have no hope of that anyway.

More plate + more IA + auras = win (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

More plate + more IA + auras = win (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

I dont shard my gear, nor do I want to, nor could I even if I wanted to as I would run out of shards, so more plate would give me almost zero crit chance. I have 2 levels of IA though (YAY).
And so long as I can finish T&T IWBTH with my crappy gear I dont really care too much, its not like I have anything to IW anyway.
And I dont really get why some people get so put out by the fact they cant do IW on IWBTH. I would much rather do a single quick run on battltoads or nintendo every now and then, as opposed to spending ages slogging through on IWBTH, its not like it brings any huge benefit, its only gives twice the exp as battltoads but takes twice as long. But thats just my opinion.

I dont shard my gear, nor do I want to, nor could I even if I wanted to as I would run out of shards, so more plate would give me almost zero crit chance. I have 2 levels of IA though (YAY).
And so long as I can finish T&T IWBTH with my crappy gear I dont really care too much, its not like I have anything to IW anyway.
And I dont really get why some people get so put out by the fact they cant do IW on IWBTH. I would much rather do a single quick run on battltoads or nintendo every now and then, as opposed to spending ages slogging through on IWBTH, its not like it brings any huge benefit, its only gives twice the exp as battltoads but takes twice as long. But thats just my opinion.

Bravo!

@fa怪叔叔: Lot of what you say is true but unrelated. In the end, ChosenUno was talking about players who are very rich. You still are yet to answer for any of my underlined questions.

I dont shard my gear, nor do I want to, nor could I even if I wanted to as I would run out of shards, so more plate would give me almost zero crit chance. I have 2 levels of IA though (YAY).
And so long as I can finish T&T IWBTH with my crappy gear I dont really care too much, its not like I have anything to IW anyway.
And I dont really get why some people get so put out by the fact they cant do IW on IWBTH. I would much rather do a single quick run on battltoads or nintendo every now and then, as opposed to spending ages slogging through on IWBTH, its not like it brings any huge benefit, its only gives twice the exp as battltoads but takes twice as long. But thats just my opinion.

As to the last bit, I think it's only the thought of saving on Stamina.

24 hours later, same story.

FYI

Ed: Ummm, seems to work again.
Ed2: Nope, there it goes again.
Ed3: Well muck fe. It's all heile and then kaputt; alles durcheinander.
Ed4: I'm German.

I'm glad someone else noticed the Repair Ponies, yesterday (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Same Bat Time, same Bat Channel.... Midnight UTC (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

Crossing my fingers and toes that it doesn't happen today (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

The problem with plate for people without high end gear is that any reduction in your killing speed is not made up by the additional protection that plate affords. because as has been pointed out many times the skill attacks from the monsters will hurt you far more wearing full plate than if you wear power with maybe 1 decent plate thrown in, as most monsters will be dead before they can use skill attacks(except for monsters that spawn with bars half full....).

Boosting your damage to increase your survive ability is still possible in this patch. However, it only works in arena and its requirement is very high. I personally think you have to have more than 200 in total (estoc+power) to do this.

@fa怪叔叔: Lot of what you say is true but unrelated. In the end, ChosenUno was talking about players who are very rich. You still are yet to answer for any of my underlined questions.

I'm not replying to ChosenUno but you. And I'm sure that I have already answered all your questions and if you feel I mised some of them, I'm sure that you can get the answer by urself if you keep playing.

*WHINNNEEEE*
long time i didnt that... also stop worring.. is a game...

*WHINNNEEEE*
long time i didnt that... also stop worring.. is a game...

+1 Excellent Post (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Bones!

Bones!

Oh fuck (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

Bones!

I prepared some lube just in case (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) .

Oh fuck (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

I prepared some lube just in case (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) .

Bones!