[X] My Assistant

Then again, how many low- and mid-level players have 20 PL750+ monsters?

Which is why I asked this

How about a more realistic set of figures for lvl35 scavenger and 20 monsters around lvl 200 playing battletoad arenas.

How many rounds and on what to keep them going

This post has been edited by teddy.bear: May 2 2013, 23:43

Instead of doing the food thing wouldn't it be better to remove the reason for creating monster armies?

An army of low-level monsters brings back far more material than one high-level monster worth the same number of crystals. To solve this you could use the number of crystals invested in a monster to determine how much material it brings back. A low-level army worth 10million crystals might bring back 100 pieces of material, but it would be mostly low- to mid-grade. Meanwhile one monster worth 10million crystals would also bring back 100 pieces of material, but it would be mid- to high-grade. Done that way people would chose to create a smaller number of high-level monsters instead of an army of low-level monsters. If you liquidated all monsters so people could reassign their crystals, then the monster population problem would be solved.

Another option would be to remove monster gifts and instead have forge material drop in battle, with higher quality material dropping on higher difficulties. This would remove the incentive to create armies of low-level monsters which, after a liquidation, would lead to a much smaller number of monsters.

So, it's decided then. The food idea is cancelled. Yay!

Instead of doing the food thing wouldn't it be better to remove the reason for creating monster armies?

An army of low-level monsters brings back far more material than one high-level monster worth the same number of crystals. To solve this you could use the number of crystals invested in a monster to determine how much material it brings back. A low-level army worth 10million crystals might bring back 100 pieces of material, but it would be mostly low- to mid-grade. Meanwhile one monster worth 10million crystals would also bring back 100 pieces of material, but it would be mid- to high-grade. Done that way people would chose to create a smaller number of high-level monsters instead of an army of low-level monsters. If you liquidated all monsters so people could reassign their crystals, then the monster population problem would be solved.

Another option would be to remove monster gifts and instead have forge material drop in battle, with higher quality material dropping on higher difficulties. This would remove the incentive to create armies of low-level monsters which, after a liquidation, would lead to a much smaller number of monsters.

So, it's decided then. The food idea is cancelled. Yay!

You do realize the more you complain the better the idea look to Tenboro, right?

You do realize the more you complain the better the idea look to Tenboro, right?

Actually, TPP's last suggestion on the matter looks more useful and less of a hassle than Da Boss'.

With a little tweaking it would be feasible.

Actually, TPP's last suggestion on the matter looks more useful and less of a hassle than Da Boss'.

With a little tweaking it would be feasible.

Not another loot table pollutant (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

wont this encourage people to create multiple accounts though.

If food is tradeable(not sure if it is but some have said it will be), and crystals are already tradeable once you monster hits a high enough level you will start to lose more and more morale value each crystal upgrade as monsters can only hold 12,000 morale. So after the 8000 odd primary crystal upgrade you will lose vastly more morale each upgrade. This will inevitably lead to the situation where you have to start abandoning monsters as you can no longer keep up their morale. With multiple accounts you don't need to spend a lot of chaos tokens to create a new monster.

Why not simply make food non-tradeable and not have morale, as I cant understand the rationale behind punishing people who upgrade their monsters past the 8000 tier upgrade by making them lose increasing amounts of morale value.

I kinda like the food idea. But I'm not too wild about how low the drop rate for it could be. Guess I just have to wait and see.

Without knowing what exactly Tenboro hopes to accomplish with this (is the issue too many monsters? too many low level monsters? too many forge materials in the system?), it is hard to give alternative suggestions that solve all of the problems.

If the issue is too many monsters, hard caps on numbers is probably be the best solution. Yes, some people will create dupes to bypass the limits, but I highly doubt the number will be so high as to be that huge of a problem. Tying the maximum amount of monsters to a player's level could also help. Would players be as willing to create dupes if they were, for example, limited to 3 monsters at level 100, 5 at 200, 10 at 250, and 20 at 300+?

If the problem is people making too many low level monsters, wouldn't it just be easier to remove the possibility of monster's bringing gifts without wins? If that 25 power level monster never gets any kills because there are 15 million level-25 monsters and players are harder to kill at lower levels, then they won't bring any loot which means nobody would have an incentive to make millions of them. Theoretically, increasing the minimum power level for a monster to show up would do something similar, but unless the minimum was increased to something like PL 200, people would still find it financially prudent to make a bunch of small monsters. (People would still probably do it at 200...)

If the problem is too many forge materials, it would be easier to halve the time factor for monsters to bring loot without wins. (i.e.: Gift Chance = (# of hours since last check/2) * (1+Battles won since last gift) * 2) If people go from checking their level 25 monsters every 50 hours to every 100 hours, the amount of gifts they receive decreases dramatically.

All of those changes accomplish something (not necessarily everything, but without knowing the desired outcome, it is impossible to come up with a perfect plan) without creating a potentially tedious system that requires changes to a person's play style.

If there was some easy way to hold monster names for players at least temporarily, I'd say a change like this is worthy of resetting the monster lab system and refunding all spend crystals/chaos tokens. Nobody would be punished for making decisions based on how the system was at the time of those decisions. (Maybe I'm wrong in not seeing making a million 25PL monsters being equivalent to an obvious exploit like repeatedly donating Pony Figurines that don't get used up)

edit: There would probably be less teeth gnashing from people losing a monster name or two than there would be from just instituting the changes without doing anything else. It might be foolish to expect people to be reasonable, but if you clearly explain what prompted the change in the patch notes and why you had to reset the system, people would be more understanding than just making the change and telling people to deal with it.

This post has been edited by traficantj: May 3 2013, 04:09

Would it be too much to ask for the pills and food to start dropping a couple weeks before the changes to monster lab are introduced? At least that way we could have some time to build up a modest stash in preparation.

Well, the problem is, after the food and happy pill things kicked in, the rule of "each monster will not appear more than once every 10 rounds" still applies or not? If the answer is yes, I guess whole the game will be unplayable when you hits LV 340+

Well, the problem is, after the food and happy pill things kicked in, the rule of "each monster will not appear more than once every 10 rounds" still applies or not? If the answer is yes, I guess whole the game will be unplayable when you hits LV 340+

(IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif) Ohhhhh~I have just got 340LV (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/cry.gif)

Well, the problem is, after the food and happy pill things kicked in, the rule of "each monster will not appear more than once every 10 rounds" still applies or not? If the answer is yes, I guess whole the game will be unplayable when you hits LV 340+

Pretty sure that rule is already gone, I've seen the same monster in consecutive rounds.

Pretty sure that rule is already gone

Nope.

Pretty sure that rule is already gone, I've seen the same monster in consecutive rounds.

There are numerous monsters with similar names...

Will Tenboro allow for a refund of the crystals invested, should we decide to retire/delete our low level mobs in the upcoming patch? At least, we can still trade off the refunded crystals to those who need it. I seriously doubt that I'll be able to play that much just to feed & upkeep my newly created mobs, after reading through the previous few pages.

Will Tenboro allow for a refund of the crystals invested, should we decide to retire/delete our low level mobs in the upcoming patch? At least, we can still trade off the refunded crystals to those who need it. I seriously doubt that I'll be able to play that much just to feed & upkeep my newly created mobs, after reading through the previous few pages.

I hope that too.

If I had ever known such System is coming I would have kept the number low.
I don't feel like quitting my Job just to keep my Mobs alive.

Not another loot table pollutant (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

Feel free to elaborate on that.

IMO, another viable solution would be changing the requirements to be met if you want to create a new monster. Right now it's just a small, increasing chaos token price.

What about this:
1) a routine to let people "discard" their monsters one by one, so they can at least keep their favourite pet
2) the refund of chaos tokens and crystals invested in the discarded monsters
3) requiring the upgrade of the current monster to PL 750 or 1000 (or whatever level feels best to avoid spamming critters) plus acquisition of 50/75% of its available chaos upgrades before a new monster slot is granted.

In other words: a merit system. If you made a high enough investment in your last monster you deserve to make a new one. Otherwise you stick with only one. This way you can't have an army of PL25 tadpoles nor one of PL 400/500, without the need to introduce "hunger", "happiness" or other hard-to-balance, tedious mechanics in the game.

Will Tenboro allow for a refund of the crystals invested, should we decide to retire/delete our low level mobs in the upcoming patch? At least, we can still trade off the refunded crystals to those who need it. I seriously doubt that I'll be able to play that much just to feed & upkeep my newly created mobs, after reading through the previous few pages.

I hope that too.

If I had ever known such System is coming I would have kept the number low.
I don't feel like quitting my Job just to keep my Mobs alive.

Seriously TenB should consider giving a one-time deal to those players wishing to retire their mobs/army. I too am considering retiring some of my mobs just so I can focus on just a few.
Even then, the remaining few will get tougher to upkeep as each level upgrade gets more expensive.

Seriously TenB should consider giving a one-time deal to those players wishing to retire their mobs/army. I too am considering retiring some of my mobs just so I can focus on just a few.
Even then, the remaining few will get tougher to upkeep as each level upgrade gets more expensive.

It still won't solve the problem of people opening multiple accounts just to make more monsters. That's the main problem to solve.

It still won't solve the problem of people opening multiple accounts just to make more monsters. That's the main problem to solve.

Making food non tradeable would