[X] My Assistant

I'm hoping that we'll eventually get the AP back without having to reset.

Granted, true, health pots are contraindicated in this case. But seriously, how many slots do you have? You might need to train up a few Pack Rats.
No, I just tried, and I got sparked by the exact same number of enemies - but it happened after I got my speed up. Rei-Tenshi (I think) smacked an enemy by accident and oops, died. Mages are squishy no matter what level they're at.

Strangely enough, I never sparked again after that. I was facing 7 enemies.

Notwithstanding my higher level, I restricted myself to Electricity and Fire. Granted, I used Tier 3 spells, but at your level, you have access to Arcane Focus, Imperil and Silence. All in all, you should have an easier go at REs than I did. And yes, it took 5 times longer than before. I suspect if I had the full elemental cycle, I would have a shorter round. And also, Imperil is seriously powerful - and useful.
Somebody's Scavenger and LotD trainings are a bit too low. No matter, it's true that it takes time to build up credits.

But you literally CANNOT spend 1k worth of pots in an RE. Even from the Bazaar, a Godly Mana Pot only costs 100c, and the equivalent Spirit Pots cost 43c each. I used up 4 mana pots - and no spirit pots - and I got back 3 from the battle itself.

Holy/Dark really is much, much better, I concede. Even at crappy proficiencies (10% my current level, more or less), they do a great deal more damage. But Imperil doesn't affect them, so what you've got is all you're gonna get.

Yes, my Scav and LotD and archaeologist are only halfway trained each. It costs creds to train them which I don't have yet.


Trust me, I can burn over 1k in items (I should probably have said items instead of pots though) in one RE easily. As i said, monsters are near guaranteed to crit and never miss around me.
And I'm a cleric (holy) mage. Not a dark cleric (no access to dark yet and i don't really have dark gear), but a bright white cleric. Problem is when all the enemies I fight are super resistant to holy for whatever reason. Even with the MIT drop, if the mob is super resistant, it is quite hard to kill. Heck, I'm lucky they don't constantly one turn wipe me out even with spark. I usually end up living with 100 hp with spark proc. Then I have to choose if I want to heal first or spark first >.> My speed is usually high enough that I won't get hit by all 9? mobs at once after the first turn, but even then, crit spam. D: I'm usually stuck healing+Sparking most of my turns until I can get weaken+silence at least half the mobs in the gaps of free turns. Heck, I've died because my regen couldn't take place (my first time using regen so I thought it would heal me once it activated... It activated but didn't heal me since the mobs killed me first. I just wanted to heal 150 hp D:).


30 14 Maou Minotauros dropped [Greater Health Potion]
30 13 Gades Sinistral Of Destruction dropped [Godly Mana Potion]
30 12 You are Victorious!

Ok, whoever here plays Lufia, I love you. And your mob actually dropped something even if it was only a potion. But trust me, just looking at that, I can honestly say I lose credits in RE rather than gain it.

I suppose my only good luck so far is that heimdall/earth-walker/priestess/heaven-sent gear have been dropping for me. But I'm a cleric, so that is expected-the thing I'm pretty much automatically good at regardless of level in any game (once i get access to the class) is being a cleric.

Sorta like with the anime Saki and Saki of Side A where certain characters are "blessed" and certain tiles gravitate towards them, healing abilities gravitate towards me. In BF3, even before I unlocked the paddles and med kits, people with them unlocked would automatically start dying around me close enough to pick up their kits. Items specifically for healers would drop more often when I was around in games like PWI.

There are really only two "elements" I use: Lightning and Holy. Soon I'll be adding dark to that list. I fight an ungodly amount of mechanoids that are only weak to lightning and quite a few elementals and dragonkin and celestials. I'm sure I'll start seeing daimons after level 150 though, but I have holy already.


As an aside: Either the Monster PL vs Player Level part of the wiki is wrong and outdated or I may have broke the game 0_O

As a different aside: As a general rule, in games, monster AIs behave oddly around me and do things that they can't do normally. Like in one game, the dragon field boss is fighting everyone. I run from the opposite side because I arrived late and shouted, "I, **** vi Britannia, order you, ****, to marry me!" It immediately spun around and fired the strongest attack it had at me even though I hadn't hurt it yet and was on the opposite side of everyone that did. Then it got stuck in invincible state spamming that attack (part of why it is the strongest attack is that it is invincible while it uses it-that and it deals enough damage to ohko anyone within range of the attack's impact range). Based on the AI, it should have ignored me and gone after the person that did the most damage and only have gone after me if I was the only target in range. No, it spun around, specifically target'ed me (With the attack centered on me, I was the only person in the attack's area of effect) and attacked. I'm not sure if I was supposed to take that as an I do or an I don't >.> It seemed pretty serious about wiping out even my body from the map. Hell, my guild leader was like: You know, it isn't supposed to do that right? Wth did you do to it?

And seriously, please don't say anything is impossible, Sin is awake right now.


This post has been edited by MikukoAya: Jan 25 2013, 23:22

Why would you want to do IWBTH hourly as mage, though?

... and why not?

4 mobs... all it takes to spark me in one turn on high difficulties. I'm sorry, but this isn't back when you were level 120-149. There have been a lot of changes and I'm much lower in level than you and thus I don't have all the stuff you do.

You seem to really have problems, so I'll try to chip in with some advice, as an elemental mage close to your level.

I do IWBTH randoms ever since I got SoL at lvl 100, and I have died maybe 3-4 times. Since the patch, I died once, but that was my own fault (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) Usually I spend no potions at all, one encounter in 10 or 20 I may spend a single mana pot.

So what's my strategy?

First of all, take all HP/MP tanks, and enough SP tanks for +50% or +100% SP. Max the highest tier you have of each element, Haste, SoL, Shadow Veil, Arcane Focus, Weaken, Silence, Imperil, Cure II.

At the start of the battle: Haste, SoL, Shadow Veil; sometimes Arcane Focus
(if you have decent Agility, all this should happen before first monster attack)

Then rotate the elements, choosing mobs that have weakness as a primary target if possible.

Ignore damage!
Cure ain't gonna save you at this point.

When you spark (probably after one or two attacks), re-apply SoL, cast Cure II.
Now you should have 3 turns of +75% mitigation from sparking left over, that should keep you alive while you continue rotating the elements.

Repeat until there's one or two mobs left, or you have no more SP left. Silence/Weaken/Imperil the left-over mobs, clean them up. At this point, you should use healing when necessary. If there's more than two mobs left, you're probably dead though.

This works for me, and I don't have any godly equipment or anything. Here's my set, with a total of three potency levels, zero upgrades:
Exquisite Ebony Staff of the Elementalist or Superior Ebony Staff of Destruction
Fine Phase Cap of Surtr
Superior Phase Robe of the Owl
Exquisite Phase Gloves of Surtr
Fine Phase Pants of Surtr
Exquisite Phase Shoes of Surtr

And how fast is it? 15~20 rounds on average.

Try it if you like, ask if you have any questions. Good luck.

------------------------------------------------------

Patch comments:

I heve mixed feelings about Ether Tap. While it restores much less mana, it's also much easier to use. Since there is no need to keep the last mob alive, I find it works fine for normal arenas - I almost never used Ether Theft, but now I find myself regularly poking that last mob when Channeling is on. It helps save on potions, which is good because I'm just that cheap.

I don't play much on higher difficulties, but since I often almost get myself killed trying to proc it on normal, I'd say it's probably less than useless there.

Also, thanks for removing Curative prof., one less thing to grind. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

I'm a holy cleric. I'm not geared for elemental damage really, I just use lightning because so many of my enemies are mechanoids (mechanoids have the best overall base mitigations which is probably a huge reason i end up fighting so many). (Cure I practically full cures me)

I will admit that I don't use SP tanks though and at this point, I don't have the spare ap to get them when I'm saving up for dark and regen and such in a few levels.

(Before the patch, I'd run out of MP long before I ran out of SP-I'd maybe spark once per arena so I never bothered with SP Tanks-heck if I sparked more than once, I was probably going to die from the hits after spark anyways)

I never said that I can't do IWTBTH, I just said it cost more than what I gained out of it.

96 10 You have reached Level 145!
96 9 You gain 226 Credits!
96 8 You gain 797620 EXP!
96 7 Magic The Gandhi dropped [Godly Health Potion]
96 6 Mizunashi Akari dropped [3x Crystal of Lightning]
96 5 Undead Gladiator dropped [Godly Mana Potion]
96 4 You are Victorious!

I earned what? 500 credits total? not worth it for me. 100+43+30+226=399 credits.


Well... it is a lot easier now with the priestess staff, but... Well, with the priestess staff I'm back to running out of MP before i run out SP, lol. Not sure if that is a good thing or a bad thing >.>

==

Pretty much those of us that relied on ET got the bad end of the stick and those that didn't like using ET got the good end eh? If Tenboro made it so that killing the mob procs the new ether tap and not killing the mobs proc'ed the old et, I'd have no complaints. (even if we had to go back to old et durations) That and give us a switch so we can choose to use the old melee in some sort of options.

(Also, tenboro, please make it so we can change some of our settings ( quickbar slots and font ) mid-battle D: )

This post has been edited by MikukoAya: Jan 26 2013, 01:08

I'm a holy cleric. I'm not geared for elemental damage really, I just use lightning because so many of my enemies are mechanoids (mechanoids have the best overall base mitigations which is probably a huge reason i end up fighting so many). (Cure I practically full cures me)

I will admit that I don't use SP tanks though and at this point, I don't have the spare ap to get them when I'm saving up for dark and regen and such in a few levels.

(Before the patch, I'd run out of MP long before I ran out of SP-I'd maybe spark once per arena so I never bothered with SP Tanks-heck if I sparked more than once, I was probably going to die from the hits after spark anyways)

I never said that I can't do IWTBTH, I just said it cost more than what I gained out of it.

96 10 You have reached Level 145!
96 9 You gain 226 Credits!
96 8 You gain 797620 EXP!
96 7 Magic The Gandhi dropped [Godly Health Potion]
96 6 Mizunashi Akari dropped [3x Crystal of Lightning]
96 5 Undead Gladiator dropped [Godly Mana Potion]
96 4 You are Victorious!

I earned what? 500 credits total? not worth it for me. 100+43+30+226=399 credits.
Well... it is a lot easier now with the priestess staff, but... Well, with the priestess staff I'm back to running out of MP before i run out SP, lol. Not sure if that is a good thing or a bad thing >.>

==

Pretty much those of us that relied on ET got the bad end of the stick and those that didn't like using ET got the good end eh? If Tenboro made it so that killing the mob procs the new ether tap and not killing the mobs proc'ed the old et, I'd have no complaints. (even if we had to go back to old et durations) That and give us a switch so we can choose to use the old melee in some sort of options.

(Also, tenboro, please make it so we can change some of our settings ( quickbar slots and font ) mid-battle D: )

thats not can or cannot， anyone with proper stretegy should have 100% chance to pass,

i see you invest some on actifacts-finding, maybe that's one important reason why you so poor


below is my training, this level of cost is enough for hv playing
https://forums.e-hentai.org/uploads/post-64...-1359161944.jpg


(IMG:https://forums.e-hentai.org/uploads/post-647569-1359161944.jpg)



also, 90 of turns is very very wrong, a mage shouldn't take more than 30 turns to finish IWBTH, even with frith's 501, oyz's kei, anyeyouhun's gandi, http/308's Aoi Phoenix

This post has been edited by eqwer: Jan 26 2013, 03:24

thats not can or cannot， anyone with proper stretegy should have 100% chance to pass,

i see you invest some on actifacts-finding, maybe that's one important reason why you so poor
below is my training, this level of cost is enough for hv playing
https://forums.e-hentai.org/uploads/post-64...-1359161944.jpg
(IMG:https://forums.e-hentai.org/uploads/post-647569-1359161944.jpg)
also, 90 of turns is very very wrong, a mage shouldn't take more than 30 turns to finish IWBTH, even with frith's 501, oyz's kei, anyeyouhun's gandi, http/308's Aoi Phoenix

Go into a battle with spells above 149 (no dark, no regen 2), in mage gear, and assume every mob crits you every hit and ignores evade.

It takes quite a few turns. about 27 of those turns was debuffing.

IWBTH FSM as a mage if I want to use ET I end up spending more turns hiting it with my staff trying to get ET lvl2 and even then I cant get ET lvl 2 reliably....
If the proc chance for ET was 100% for hitting a monster it may work but as it is now it takes far too much micromanaging to get ET lvl 2 reliably, and its even harder to get it in normal rounds because we have to deal with both evade and parry, not to mention we cant exactly start whacking a monster with our stick when there a number of monsters left.
I like the way ET works now by us not having to keep the monster alive, but I think it still needs some work.

Go into a battle with spells above 149 (no dark, no regen 2), in mage gear, and assume every mob crits you every hit and ignores evade.

It takes quite a few turns. about 27 of those turns was debuffing.

do not debuff,

except for left-at-last hard-mob, more actions make mage more close to death,

a mage means he/she need to kill mobs before mobs kill he/she, if battle goes long, you are going worng

As an aside: Either the Monster PL vs Player Level part of the wiki is wrong and outdated or I may have broke the game 0_O

Details please.

Details please.

I fought a monster higher level than I should have fought at the difficulty and level I was at. Not by much, but still. (Granted, when the mobs are like 200+ pl above you, a few pls above doesn't really matter). If I see it happen again, I'll screenshot I guess. Pretty rare for me to scan though. I only vaguely remembered because the power level was a bit higher than i was expecting. It was like 354 or 358 (It was 35x) or something when I should have only been seeing up to 348 or so. It was a few days ago and before I actually checked the wiki table. I THINK it was after 0.73 but it might've been a day or two before.

do not debuff,

except for left-at-last hard-mob, more actions make mage more close to death,

a mage means he/she need to kill mobs before mobs kill he/she, if battle goes long, you are going worng

Even with 75% damage reduction, 9 crits is a bit much. I have to cast weakness and often I also have to cast silence. Your level is simply way too high to understand =_= I'm actually less likely to die the way I play than if I just went all out going berserk. Once I get dark, I'll be able to kill faster, but until then...

Sure, if all 9 mobs I fought were undead, I'd skip the debuffs and go straight to holy spells and hope I can get a few down. But how likely is that? I don't have any good elemental gear, only holy/divine/supportive gear.


In addition, ever consider in resists and parry and evade on the monster side? First I use magic to have it get resisted. Then I give up and melee and my target parries.

I have horrible luck. Assume every monster in the game gets +50% hit chance, +50% crit chance, +50% resist, +50% evade, +50% parry when fighting me. That is how bad my luck is.


And no, my name is not Kamijou Touma... I think he might have more luck than me. My luck is closer to Kurusu Karin's level... (It isn't rock bottom bad luck like Karin's but it is definitely bad). My luck is so horrible that it has become a joke among a lot of my friends. "How did you roll a 0 on every single item in the last 10 dungeons we've been in?"


Regardless, I can do IWBTH, it just takes a lot more work than most people would take. I almost died because I ended up melee'ing instead of casting a spell x.x . For some reason, my click on the skillbar didn't register... Well, that is why I have spark...


Hmmm... as i suspected... If i complain about my bad luck long enough, I'll get a bout of normal luck. Actually got a group of mobs that only sparked me once. 0_o . 36 turns... 5 mobs. A lot less exp though in exchange.


You know, ever since I started doing IWBTH RE, I haven't gotten my channeling chains...

This post has been edited by MikukoAya: Jan 26 2013, 05:09

I fought a monster higher level than I should have fought at the difficulty and level I was at. Not by much, but still. (Granted, when the mobs are like 200+ pl above you, a few pls above doesn't really matter). If I see it happen again, I'll screenshot I guess. Pretty rare for me to scan though. I only vaguely remembered because the power level was a bit higher than i was expecting. It was like 354 or 358 (It was 35x) or something when I should have only been seeing up to 348 or so. It was a few days ago and before I actually checked the wiki table. I THINK it was after 0.73 but it might've been a day or two before.
Even with 75% damage reduction, 9 crits is a bit much. I have to cast weakness and often I also have to cast silence. Your level is simply way too high to understand =_= I'm actually less likely to die the way I play than if I just went all out going berserk. Once I get dark, I'll be able to kill faster, but until then...

Sure, if all 9 mobs I fought were undead, I'd skip the debuffs and go straight to holy spells and hope I can get a few down. But how likely is that? I don't have any good elemental gear, only holy/divine/supportive gear.
In addition, ever consider in resists and parry and evade on the monster side? First I use magic to have it get resisted. Then I give up and melee and my target parries.

I have horrible luck. Assume every monster in the game gets +50% hit chance, +50% crit chance, +50% resist, +50% evade, +50% parry when fighting me. That is how bad my luck is.
And no, my name is not Kamijou Touma... I think he might have more luck than me. My luck is closer to Kurusu Karin's level... (It isn't rock bottom bad luck like Karin's but it is definitely bad). My luck is so horrible that it has become a joke among a lot of my friends. "How did you roll a 0 on every single item in the last 10 dungeons we've been in?"
Regardless, I can do IWBTH, it just takes a lot more work than most people would take. I almost died because I ended up melee'ing instead of casting a spell x.x . For some reason, my click on the skillbar didn't register... Well, that is why I have spark...

all hv‘s chances are governed by a php random number generator, the characteristics of it, is it always make chance together, for example, you see channeling happens in close time span, then you have rest time don't have any channeling, that is the style of how hv‘s random number generator acts, not purely random, but also abslutely not as you said, act totally non-randomly


for your feeling about our level difference, is also not that true, i was using that that aggresive fighting stretegy since i became a reborned mage(in lv.123), though tenb made several pathes after that, resist of monster came out, and recently mit reduction, the core ideas of the stretegy didn't change, it is a effective stretegy lot of mages use


numbers of mobs really isn't biggest issue, action speed and player magic damage output is the one, you get spark trigger simply because you are too slow, and you spark too much simply because your output is too low, did't kill them all in proper time

for resist, i'd suggest you use the skill "focus" when you dealing the last one mob

all hv‘s chances are governed by a php random number generator, the characteristics of it, is it always make chance together, for example, you see channeling happens in close time span, then you have rest time don't have any channeling, that is the style of how hv‘s random number generator acts, not purely random, but also abslutely not as you said, act totally non-randomly
for your feeling about our level difference, is also not that true, i was using that that aggresive fighting stretegy since i became a reborned mage(in lv.123), though tenb made several pathes after that, resist of monster came out, and recently mit reduction, the core ideas of the stretegy didn't change, it is a effective stretegy lot of mages use
numbers of mobs really isn't biggest issue, action speed and player magic damage output is the one, you get spark trigger simply because you are too slow, and you spark too much simply because your output is too low, did't kill them all in proper time

for resist, i'd suggest you use the skill "focus" when you dealing the last one mob

Because it is random, it can act non-randomly. The theory is that if you if enough attempts are made, the average result will tend towards the proper probability. But if say, I take the worst 1000 rolls, and someone else takes the best 1000 rolls, the result will still be the same on average, will it not?

The average roll of two die is 7. If i roll 2 die and consistently get 12 while someone else roll for roll consistently gets 2, our combined average is still 7.

My point is when the monsters are really only weak to melee or dark, I'm going to do less damage. Especially fighting a group of mechanoids which resist everything but lightning and celestials which are weak to soul and physical but strong against holy (my specialty). You are talking about back when you first changed over, I'm talking about now. There have been changes in game mechanics and there probably has been changes to what races tend to appear.

When they start spamming resist against me and crits, it doesn't matter how much damage I do unless I can one hit them and ignore resist completely (and I'm not about to focus when there are a bunch of mobs waiting to hit me). And consider in that when I drop them to a sliver of hp, they do a LOT more damage. And when they keep resisting, I now have this monster that is whacking me for half my hp each attack. Sure, I get 2-3 turns to act, but as I said, worst luck will happen when I can't afford it.

That said, I'll take a few extra turns to scan them, debuff them, and make sure that I'm safe. Sure, I won't get the uber kill speeds that other would get, but it is safer. (I suppose once I get x-nerf, I'll be able to just drop that and then spam dark/holy.

As for low damage... I can 2-3 hit quite a few mobs I fight if they don't resist even without imperil. The problem is resist.



As I said before, it isn't that I fail IWBTH RE, it just costs more than I gain. Especially compared to arenas where I get a guaranteed drop and some guaranteed credits. (I consider one round of RE to be two rounds of an Arena). Sure, if I was only after exp, IWBTH RE is nice. But aside from unlocking stuff, I'm more concerned about credits. Plus, for the most part, I prefer to use RE purely for prof'ing.

This post has been edited by MikukoAya: Jan 26 2013, 05:47

the reason for "costs > gain" is action speed, output and you do worthless cures, debuffes and staff melees,


for high mit of mobs, use imperil, but i'd suggest use it after all holy-weaked and holy neutral died

You are definitely wrong about PL of monsters you can face. On IWBTH you can face monsters up to 846 at your level; or on normal 318. I was your level only a few weeks ago, so I do remember what it was like. Random luck happens all the time, no one always gets the worst of it. Just this last week it took me 36 turns to kill the first monster in my RE. Thirty Six. First Monster. I have to assume that you are either doing something very wrong or have terrible gear to struggle so much.

Something is very hinkey with the browser you use.

Battletoads IW, 1st Round, Fine equip

8 5 You gain 17146 EXP!
8 4 Cerenium dropped [Exquisite Wakizashi of the Nimble]
8 3 You are Victorious!
8 2 Kosuke Ueki has been defeated

Shrined 2 Artifacts, got 3 Hath each.

Yes, I think Chrome is the way to go (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Edit: Then again, maybe not.

25 7 You gain 69998 EXP!
25 6 Redbulled Chicken dropped [Fair Plate Greaves of the Fire-eater]
25 5 Ouzai Berserker Mode dropped [Godly Mana Potion]
25 4 Ruby dropped [Superior Mana Potion]
25 3 You are Victorious!

This post has been edited by xmagus: Jan 26 2013, 07:16

You are definitely wrong about PL of monsters you can face. On IWBTH you can face monsters up to 846 at your level; or on normal 318. I was your level only a few weeks ago, so I do remember what it was like. Random luck happens all the time, no one always gets the worst of it. Just this last week it took me 36 turns to kill the first monster in my RE. Thirty Six. First Monster. I have to assume that you are either doing something very wrong or have terrible gear to struggle so much.

350+ PL on hard mode? My name is not no one btw...

And eq, I tried your method. It really doesn't help I just outright die from crits. Even dropping my best spells, I got massively nuked before I could kill enough not be one turn killed. (heck one mob alone one hit me the second turn it got via skill and crit).

I think I'll stick to my method of doing things... For me, following your suggestions is no different from flipping a coin 5 or less, I can do it, more than that, I'm dead. For most people, it would work, not for me. The other person's suggestions is more in-line with my style and is pretty much what i do anyways for boss level fights. It takes longer, but it is safer.

My belief has always been if something can go wrong, it will go wrong. That belief has never failed me >.> Funny thing though is that my luck seems to depend on both the seasons and the name I am using at the time. (I use each name for about 2-3 years at a time).

This post has been edited by MikukoAya: Jan 26 2013, 07:31

should be 343

This update made the iwbth lvl mod +100. In 0.72 it was +50.

should be 343

My point exactly... It should be 34x, I got something over 350. It was probably just a fluke though.

This post has been edited by MikukoAya: Jan 26 2013, 07:24

Or the limit is not a hard limit but a soft one.

Or the limit is not a hard limit but a soft one.

I'm glad there is a limit at all, but that is a frightening thought. Cus if there is no hard limit, then....

I'm going to fight a 1k+ PL monster in a few minutes, just you watch =_=