[X] My Assistant

Lower tier equipment was better . . . look at rapier and club t1 vs waka t3. Which were people using?

Estocs too lol. It should have been T3 before with how powerful it was.

It seems monsters hit much harder after the patch.

It seems monsters hit much harder after the patch.

They don't hit harder, we are just softer. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

Aw, Power Armor users are now QQing because they can't kill almost as fast as a mage and be invulnerable anymore. And before this patch you couldn't IWBTH IW? I'm sorry but your equipment sucks balls.

The whole point of Slaughter Power is to do more damage while maintaining a decent defense and a high magic consumption. Now the 1st two are worse without any offset on the 3rd. And yes I found Exquisite and above IWBTH IW to be either too unbalanced or too tedious. And I assume Exquisite, Mag, and a little bit of Legendary is considered to be in your "sucks balls" category.

Seriously, what the fuck is with you melees QQing over how you can't go full Power Armor and still be a tank? Have you ever heard of plate? Or god-forbid Shield armor?

I did mention Shield heavy. Please review my post for details. And I play as both Mage and Melee depending. Also indicated by the post.

And 2H is broken. Seriously? 2H was OP all this time and you know it. Don't lie to yourself. Estoc has been the most OP weapon in the game for like over half a year, and now it's nerfed to a more reasonable level and you QQ over how everything is ruined for 2H. Yeah, right.

Having only 1 out of 5 2H weapons that is effective is OP in your book? Longsword and Scythe were abandoned long ago due to bleed nerf (although some have said it's a little better now), Mace was essentially ruined (just ask Bunko if he ever returns), and Katana and Niten doesn't even get full benefits for the trade-off. That left Estoc as the only really effective 2H option. Which is now nerfed. Perhaps you'd like to share your best melee Estoc build with us?

Long runs with mage is not feasible anymore? Are you sure? I can still hit 1000 rounds of gf with relative ease, since the bottleneck for mages hasn't changed.

Well, let's see your equipment. And see what you have for Hath perks as well.

- JC

This post has been edited by jcullinane: Jan 21 2013, 06:51

I'll bite. So, what kind of power gear was needed to oh so easily complete IWBTH IWs before the patch? (Serious question here, I surely couldn't, my gear is in my WTB topic from my sig, feel free to tell me what sucks about it. I know it's probably far from good, but the best I could find/afford)

Also, don't tell me you think it's right that tier 1 armor is better than tier 3, you know yourself that's wrong.

Where the "QQing" comes from? Should be obvious, shouldn't it? Heavy took the hugest hit in this patch, mitigation and mana cost mainly I'd say, but that'd quite huge if you suddenly need to cure several times in a round.
The damage probably evens out with the monster mit nerf.
Light lost some PMI but their evade was untouched. Mages take more damage, but if you're a one-shot anyways that doesn't matter much, does it?

Also, weren't mages already superior when it came to speed and clearing arenas? Main concerns I always read about were long GF and IW runs. Now the discrepancy is even bigger.

You shouldn't use protection powers. It sucks. Why? It gives less damage and PMI than plate + slaughter, while giving you much higher B/I than plate + power.

As for mana cost and mitigation, move to using more plate and less power. You reduce interference and gain PMI. Simple huh (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

As for long GFs, I'm pretty sure that 4EverLost will now clear like 900 rounds of IWBTH GF instead of 1000 like before. Big freaking deal (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

You don't see mages going for even 300 rounds of IWBTH, do you? I don't see any discrepancy getting bigger.

Remember that while mages can go for 1000 rounds, that's on normal. We pretty much give up all hope of finding items. While melee can get both crystals AND good items. Fair?

Mace was essentially ruined (just ask Bunko if he ever returns),

he'll complain more about credits removal from grindfest (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/duck.gif)

Good thing that this game allows you to be an idort. I can use 2H, DW, Dark and Holy magic now, just need a few clicks to change equipment set

I was wondering why Cure was giving Supportive Proficiency. A shame, I was hoping to see something big if it Curative got to a large number.

One minor change..

- If your Curative Proficiency was higher than your Supportive Proficiency, the highest of the two will be used to calculate the effective Supportive Proficiency.

There are a couple of additional not-intended-as-nerfs-but-apparently-worked-out-that-way things I'll look at in the morning.

I've just checked this, under statistics my supportive is what my curative used to be.

HOWEVER, my supportive was a lot lower than before so I spent some time grinding it. Turns out I gained a lot of supportive prof BUT not the effective one. e.g. leveling your supportive doesn't level from where your curative used to be (it's leveling my old supportive which was a lot lower), this is still a a massive nerf to those who had high curative. Why not just up the new supportive to the max of the old supportive/curative?

Also, can I have the levels I did grinding on move to the new stat? Feels like I got scammed leveling something that doesn't work.

This post has been edited by desert storm: Jan 21 2013, 07:25

And before this patch you couldn't IWBTH IW? I'm sorry but your equipment sucks balls.

I couldn't IWBTH IW (at least not for exquisite+ equipment) and I don't think my equipment was terrible. Not the best, but not horrible either. I think your hate for heavy is making you exaggerate a bit.

Remember that while mages can go for 1000 rounds, that's on normal. We pretty much give up all hope of finding items. While melee can get both crystals AND good items. Fair?

How do you achieve 1000 rounds? I find myself running out of mana potion at 100.

This post has been edited by Insania: Jan 21 2013, 08:34

(IMG:[i480.photobucket.com] http://i480.photobucket.com/albums/rr163/anomtai/preistess.png)

Good thing I abandoned this play style a while ago.

Also, mfw there are 787 Gaia infusions in the bazaar

This post has been edited by Anomtai: Jan 21 2013, 07:39

The whole point of Slaughter Power is to do more damage while maintaining a decent defense and a high magic consumption. Now the 1st two are worse without any offset on the 3rd. And yes I found Exquisite and above IWBTH IW to be either too unbalanced or too tedious. And I assume Exquisite, Mag, and a little bit of Legendary is considered to be in your "sucks balls" category.
I did mention Shield heavy. Please review my post for details. And I play as both Mage and Melee depending. Also indicated by the post.
Having only 1 out of 5 2H weapons that is effective is OP in your book? Longsword and Scythe were abandoned long ago due to bleed nerf (although some have said it's a little better now), Mace was essentially ruined (just ask Bunko if he ever returns), and Katana and Niten doesn't even get full benefits for the trade-off. That left Estoc as the only really effective 2H option. Which is now nerfed. Perhaps you'd like to share your best melee Estoc build with us?
Well, let's see your equipment. And see what you have for Hath perks as well.

- JC

Well, per previous patch Skillchip did some experimentation and found out that fully forged dark mages can only do 1.56x more damage than power slaughter worst case, while getting hit for at least 4x the amount.

As for your definition of Power Slaughter, no that's not how it is. I haven't seen Tenboro making a definite statement on how Power Slaughter should be, so whatever you think it is is your opinion.

And yes, estoc is OP. You don't think that a weapon that has a proc that bypasses EVERY SINGLE DEFENSE a monster has is not OP? That's what a voided estoc with PA is.

And no, maces is not ruined. It works well, slow and safe. Doesn't mean it doesn't work. Same with scythe. It's slow(er), but it still does its job well.

Now you actually have to make decisions about trade-offs as a melee and you're complaining that it's impossible already? I think that the decision is actually very simple. If you're dying, wear more plate. If you're still dying wearing full plate, buy new plates/lower difficulty/better weapon. If you're running out of mana, then obviously you're not using Focus enough.

Anyway, my perks: IA4, Rainbow, crystarium 3.
My items:
Legendary Ethereal Katalox Staff of the Heaven-sent
Magnificent Phase Cap of Heimdall
Magnificent Phase Robe of Heimdall
Legendary Phase Gloves of Heimdall
Magnificent Phase Pants of Heimdall
Magnificent Phase Shoes of Heimdall

You know what the funny thing is? Even with all that gear, I still can't do IWBTH arenas that are longer than 90 rounds with great stamina. Ha ha ha.

And I probably spent about 30-40 mil on that set, give or take (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

This post has been edited by ChosenUno: Jan 21 2013, 07:44

I couldn't IWBTH IW (at least not for exquisite+ equipment) and I don't think my equipment was terrible. Not the best, but not horrible either. I think your hate for heavy is making you exaggerate a bit.

Nah, I could regularly do Legendary with full Power. I tried out IWBTH with 3 piece power and 2 piece plate last patch, but it's too tedious. I didn't die, though. Nor run out of mana.

And it's tedious because my ping is 350ms. If it was something like <100ms, I'd never mage (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

(IMG:https://forums.e-hentai.org/uploads/post-245367-1358747383.png)
(IMG:https://forums.e-hentai.org/uploads/post-245367-1358747287.jpg)

Fuck the complainers, I make my own fun.

Nah, I could regularly do Legendary with full Power. I tried out IWBTH with 3 piece power and 2 piece plate last patch, but it's too tedious. I didn't die, though. Nor run out of mana.

And it's tedious because my ping is 350ms. If it was something like <100ms, I'd never mage (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

meh, I guess I haven't forged my plate and estoc enough (I either use 3 or 4 plates and 2 or 1 slaughters). I can do BT but not IWBTH (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/anime_cry.gif) .

You shouldn't use protection powers. It sucks. Why? It gives less damage and PMI than plate + slaughter, while giving you much higher B/I than plate + power.

As for mana cost and mitigation, move to using more plate and less power. You reduce interference and gain PMI. Simple huh (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Sorry, but that's way exaggerated. I'm not even going to mention the absurd price of slaughter armor. I compared my gear with 3 plate (head, chest and legs) and 2 power, the difference was ~79% pmi vs 80%. The difference is just not high enough to say that IWBTH suddenly becomes easier.

As for long GFs, I'm pretty sure that 4EverLost will now clear like 900 rounds of IWBTH GF instead of 1000 like before. Big freaking deal (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Yea, right, let's compare everyone to the probably best geared melee. (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
What about danixxx, HTTP, Sushi? Hint: if you balance for the top 2% playerbase you're doing it wrong. (in my opinion at least)

You don't see mages going for even 300 rounds of IWBTH, do you? I don't see any discrepancy getting bigger.

Remember that while mages can go for 1000 rounds, that's on normal. We pretty much give up all hope of finding items. While melee can get both crystals AND good items. Fair?

Read again, I was talking about arenas. There is no 300 round arena. Not everyone has the time to "endlessly" grind GF. I'll agree that there are problems with GF between mage and melee (although the only data I've seen from melee is always from 4EverLost, just because he can, doesn't mean that everyone can)
I was merely saying/asking that mages became even better for arenas while melee got worse even though mages were already better.

meh, I guess I haven't forged my plate and estoc enough (I either use 3 or 4 plates and 2 or 1 slaughters). I can do BT but not IWBTH (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/anime_cry.gif) .

Estoc is probably where you should forge the most. That'll be where most of your damage comes from. I'm blessed to have an estoc with something like 95 base WD (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Having a few 22.5+ power of slaughter pieces doesn't hurt either. Or having legendary and magnificent plates of protection with max PMI (IMG:[invalid] style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

So does this mean Soul will be removed at some point?

That's the idea.

so...

if soul is getting removed, is there gonna be some new toys spells put in there place?

also, what about the monsters with soul attacks?

You know what the funny thing is? Even with all that gear, I still can't do IWBTH arenas that are longer than 90 rounds with great stamina. Ha ha ha.

Alright, now this is finally some information I've been asking for. Whenever I brought up arenas all I heard was stuff like "yes, mages are faster than melee" and "danixxx DwD IWBTH in 15min"... you get the idea.
Now if you can't even clear Trio with that gear, I really wonder what kind of gear those have that can.

About your melee gear, I can see how you can do fine with that. But that already some pretty good stuff I dare say, you always made it sound like IWBTH was easy with your average run-of-the-mill heavy gear.